posted on August 11, 2004 08:15:20 AM
On Aug 1st I posted a thread regarding a new jacket that I won & paid for with a credit card on PayPal. Got it at a great price for a total of $15.99 which included shipping. However seller never sent it and did not respond to my emails though she was actively listing things on eBay. As such, I disputed it with PayPal.
Today I received the following email from PayPal:
[i]We have determined that the seller is at fault, and as a result, we have attempted to recover your funds. The maximum amount we were able to recover was $0.49 USD. This amount has been credited to your account. Please allow up to 5 days for this adjustment to be reflected in your account.
If you are due any additional amount from the seller, please be assured that we will make our best effort to recover the balance from the seller on your behalf.
You can also be assured that we will take appropriate action against the seller in this case. Actions may include issuing a warning, a temporary limitation, or terminating their account. PayPal uses a number of factors to determine what type of action to take, including member complaints. Due to privacy laws, we are unable to discuss the details of any action. We hope you understand our policy, and that it ensures you are safe when using PayPal.
We appreciate your business, and regret this experience.[/i]
Well you know, I regret it too but I'm certainly not going to settle for 49 cents when I paid with a credit card. Obviously $15.99 is a small amount but even so, I can't believe PayPal will not reimburse me the full amount after they verified the seller is at fault and that I paid with a credit card. Are they just hoping I'll not dispute this on my credit card (which I will)? What am I missing here (aside from the fact that I think there are some stupid people at PayPal)?
posted on August 11, 2004 08:23:13 AM
Pay Pal can only deduct what is in that sellers account at the time that they try. At least that is the party line answer. Good luck with the credit card, I've tried that in the past and gotten the "You dealt with a third party so you must go to them [Pay Pal]" answer. Please keep us posted, now I'm curious.
Kevin
posted on August 11, 2004 08:53:38 AM
That's correct, & you ARE following the rules by adhering to PayPal's policy regarding non-delivery of goods when paid for with a credit card.
Since there ain't no moola in the pretzel-choker's account, PayPal cannot refund you anything.
Thus, the next step is the CHARGE BACK with yer CC company which should be easy since the SELLER cannot provide shipping info.
If they refuse, be sure to file with the FBI/FTC internet fraud site.
I did this when a certain un-named vendor (that everybody knows of) refused to refund my $9 with the excuse that since PP froze his account, he wasn't about to refund all the folks he took.
Guess again, pal! Once the cops called with a friendly "HELLO," the moola magically arrived in my mail!
“Our enemies are innovative and resourceful, and so are we! They never stop thinking about new ways to harm our country and our people, and neither do we.” ~ GWBush White House 8/5/4
posted on August 11, 2004 09:12:07 AM
I too received the "third party" transaction explanation when DiscoverCard didn't let me dispute a PayPal charge on an item that got lost in shipment back in November 2002. Very fortunately for me, the seller did eventually reimburse my $100 albeit nearly 3 months later after she received her money from UPS.
Interestingly on 7/14/04 I received a letter from DiscoverCard saying "Our records indicate that we may not have resolved this dispute to your satisfaction... Since Discover Card is commited to superior customer service, you now have the right to re-dispute a PayPal transaction that you disputed..."
I paid for this jacket with my DiscoverCard. We'll see how committed they are to superior customer service.
But I'm really concerned with how PayPal will react to my disputing this with DiscoverCard. A couple of years ago, I purchased jewelry from a Canadian seller who had excellent feedback but warned in her description that shipping could take up to 6 weeks. I went ahead and waited the 6 weeks and when they didn't arrive, I placed it in dispute on my credit card (because my 30 days was up with PayPal). About a week later, sure enough they arrived and with a postmark date of the day after I paid. I then repaid her with PayPal.
A few months later, my PayPal account was temporarily suspended. I couldn't pay for anything nor could I touch the money in it that I received from sales. It was a Friday evening when I discovered this when I was trying to pay for some auctions. I immediately called PayPal asking why my account was suspended and the lady told me it was because I had previously disputed a PayPal charge on my credit card instead of going thru them and that it cost them money. I explained the situation to her and said I repaid this seller via PayPal about a week later when the jewelry arrived. She verified this and said that it would be Monday or Tuesday before my account would be activated again. Apparently their "reactivate-account" people don't work weekends. I suspect this is one of the reasons the PayPal lawsuit was initiated.
posted on August 11, 2004 09:13:56 AM
question-
since the seller is still listing and selling and i assume accepting payment with paypal,would you still stand a chance of getting the remaining money owed you??
does paypal continue trying to collect from her??
-sig file -------we eat to live,not live to eat.
Benjamin Franklin
posted on August 11, 2004 09:40:48 AM
I went back and looked at her completed auctions and out of 146 total, 28 ended with bids (she sells clothes). Her positives have increased by 2 after I won this, and she hasn't received any negs yet. She hasn't listed anything after Aug 6th which is when her latest round of auctions ended.
I disputed this on Aug 1st. I suppose there is the chance I could retrieve the rest of my money from PayPal if one of the Aug 6th winners is now getting around to paying her. But since it's now Aug 11th, I doubt that. This is probably a situation where it's "first come first served/reimbursed".
As a result of that class action settlement, PayPay had to establish a customer service phone number. I think it's an 800 number, too.
Have you tried calling them?
I thought so long as you put it into dispute within 30 days, you should be able to do a chargeback via PayPal, if the seller can't furnish proof of delivery via a D/C or UPS tracking number ... ???
And, if it's beyond 30 days, then they try to re-imburse you with funds from the seller's account ... ????
Maybe they goofed in thinking you were beyond 30 days when you weren't .. ???
posted on August 11, 2004 06:36:50 PM
and since u've experienced a frozen account before, they may still freeze your account if you file this chargeback.
next time, for bigger purchases.. I recommend going with a VISA or MasterCard credit card.
edit: ah forgot there's edit button. as for the 30 day thing, actually.. they try to get your money back via the seller's account, then the seller's linked bank account. If all those empty, all you'll get is well, nothing.
After 30 days they wont do anything whatsoever for you.
[ edited by CapYoda on Aug 11, 2004 06:38 PM ]
They can no longer touch your personal bank account. This changed awhile ago.
Cheryl
. . .if you still try to defend the infamies and horrors perpetrated by that Antichrist- I really believe he is Antichrist- I will have nothing more to do with you and you are no longer my friend.. . - War and Peace, Tolstoy
posted on August 12, 2004 05:09:41 AM
cap,
but the seller would not be able to use paypal to accept payment in the future,which could hamper his sales on ebay.
-sig file -------we eat to live,not live to eat.
Benjamin Franklin
posted on August 12, 2004 10:23:23 AMI went back and looked at her completed auctions and out of 146 total, 28 ended with bids (she sells clothes). Her positives have increased by 2 after I won this, and she hasn't received any negs yet. She hasn't listed anything after Aug 6th which is when her latest round of auctions ended.
I guess she isn't NARU, then.
It just seems odd to me that a seller who would default on PayPal transactions still gets to keep their eBay registration. They are not really separate companies, right?
posted on August 12, 2004 02:20:22 PM
One of the things I've always disliked about PayPal is that they're constantly putting through new "updates."
Here's what I found:
This Policy was last modified on June 4, 2004.
1. General. PayPal's Buyer Complaint Policy is designed to try to help buyers recover funds from sellers who do not ship the promised goods. Buyer complaints must be filed within 30 days of the payment and, even if the buyer’s claim is justified, the buyer will receive a recovery only if there are funds in the seller’s account. RECOVERY OF YOUR CLAIM IS NOT GUARANTEED.
So, in other words, they're telling you to use your credit card for protection, but if I'm reading this June 4 document correctly, they won't credit your credit card, even if you file within 30 days and they find in your favor. Instead, they'll try to recover the cash from the seller's account. The rest of this document talks about how you can then file for a chargeback with your CC company if there's no cash in the seller's account.
So I just learned something. I always that that so long as you got in under the wire on that 30-day limit, if they found for you, they'd credit your credit card - end of story.
There was something else in one of the "updates" - that if a seller had a negative balance with PayPal as a result of a chargeback, the seller had X no. of days to cover that balance. I can't find that section right now, but I think it said 7 days.
So, if that's the case, by now, PayPal should have given the seller X number of days to put enough into her account to cover the $15.99 plus the $10 penalty PayPal assesses for a reversed payment.
I wish I could find that part of the text again. There's a penalty if the seller doesn't deposit enough funds to cover the deficit.
