posted on September 21, 2001 12:05:36 AM
Ok, no one going to read it. Suddenly I think this man that I have admired for some of his works, (and apparently been ignorant of others) is something of a quack. I know there are lots of people who admire him.
I wondered if the majority was aware that he may be a little flakey.
posted on September 21, 2001 12:11:20 AM
I read it when you posted it, JT. And, yes, he struck me as a quack, nut, what you will. But then, so many of these guys are.
posted on September 21, 2001 04:39:26 AM
Yeah another one of those preachers who will look a mother in the face and say " God needed another angel so that's why your little girl died in agony in a fire." As if he didn't have angels before man ever was.
A self serving, shrieking, yelling preacher to get fools all worked up who equate emotion with sincerity. The kind who run back and forth in front of the camera sweating and grimacing - in other words an actor.
They have their sucker lists and work the marks like any scam.
posted on September 21, 2001 05:52:43 AM
I didn't think the article was that bad.
1) God's name IS being erased from textbooks.
2) In the U.S. 40 million babies have been killed in the procedure called abortion.
3) Many do worship silver and gold.
All he asks is not to blame others, but each of us to look in our hearts & see if we are following God's commands. Try to make ourselves, personally, right with God. Reflection & repentance, along with the remembrance for the poor people who have died.
posted on September 21, 2001 07:10:17 AM
As soon as I heard how he was getting these vague messages from God I had enough.
These messages are clear enough to quote later but never clear enough to give warning before hand. Jonah he is not.
I am sorry his God is not articulate enough to do anything but disturb him with fuzzy messages of feeling and forbodding. But maybe it is the reciever - I guess he works with what he has at hand. The Great potter can do better than a cracked pot.
posted on September 21, 2001 08:09:36 AM
Oh, I dunno. I can't really fault the guy for reminding people what their religion actually teaches, even if I don't happen to share those beliefs. I think too many so-called "Christians" want to focus solely on the "warm fuzzies" in the Bible ["love thy neighbor as thy self", "turn the other cheek", etc.] and ignore all the rest of it [you know, the parts that say "obey me or I will smite you"]
If this guy were twisting Biblical verses or taking them out of context to support his own private agenda, I'd say he was being hypocritical like many preachers. But I think he's actually just reminding people what it really means to be a God-fearing Christian.
The only fault I can find with his argument is simply that comparing America with the Biblical land of Israel may not be valid. Ancient Israel was founded as a theocracy in the first place, and was supposedly made up of only the "chosen" people of God. So when God's chosen people began to ignore him, he had to send the country as a whole a wake up call. America, on the other hand, is NOT, and has never been, a theocracy, and is inhabited by people of all faiths and creeds [or lack thereof]. So it's kind of hard to think about God sending the entire country a message when only a small portion are "his" people.
Again, I don't happen to share this guy's beliefs, but I also don't think he's that out of line insofar as what the Bible actually teaches. Christianity is nothing more than "comfort food" to some people, but there's a lot of brocolli, liver, and castor oil in there as well. And if people can't stomach the unpleasant with the pleasant, maybe they need to find themselves another diet and stop calling themselves "Christians" in the first place.
Sorry if that offends anybody. It's just my $0.02, and please feel free to ignore it as you see fit.
Barry [Born a Jew, raised a Christian, and now just trying to lead a moral life without a "label"]
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The opinions expressed above are for comparison purposes only. Your mileage may vary....
posted on September 21, 2001 09:44:42 AMI think too many so-called "Christians" want to focus solely on the "warm fuzzies" in the Bible ["love thy neighbor as thy self", "turn the other cheek", etc.
Barry, was my cam turned on last night and you could SEE me?
I dunno..Im having a hard time here. I took the advice of a few posters and started reading the NT and as I was reading the bold section above, I began to squirm a bit. Im not too good at turning the other cheek and loving my no-good-thieving neighbor as myself, along with a few other things Im supposed to do. This is not gonna be easy.
posted on September 21, 2001 09:58:18 AM
"But you see, Times Square Church was warned a calamity was coming. We are now in the seventh week of a visitation of the Holy Spirit and if you have been coming to this church you know that even weeks before that the Holy Spirit moved on the pastoral staff here to cancel everything."
"We were crying out to God and then the Holy Spirit spoke clearly that it was happening because a tragedy was coming – a calamity was coming to this city and to the nation and we didn’t know what it was. Suddenly a calamity struck the nation and especially here in New York City."
The guy says "god was not surprised." He says god gave him a frightful vision in 1973 & that the word of hope given him after the vision was that he (god) has everything under control. So god was behind the terrorist attack?
Then he goes on to talk about how god "woos" by sending light, then not-so-light "afflictions." That's one of the real weird things about Christianity. It claims that their god has given them free will to make their own choices. Ah, but make choices that god doesn't like and he smites you. Yes, I see a lot of "free will" in that. It claims that its god is one of love & peace, yet the Bible is filled with instances of that very same god happily sending folks to kill others or punishing folks he doesn't like.
posted on September 21, 2001 10:03:04 AMIt claims that its god is one of love & peace, yet the Bible is filled with instances of that very same god happily sending folks to kill others or punishing folks he doesn't like.
YES! That is yet another reason why I have shied away from church and Bible reading. It is full of contradictions.
You are supposed to turn the other cheek, but SMITE those enemies in the name of good and the righteous; Be peaceful, and the meek shall inherit the earth. Know you will be reviled for worshipping me, but YOU will gain heaven when I whip their butts because they gave you a hard time.
I dont get it. No, Im not asking for explanation...dont need to turn this into Bible study. Im just telling of the example of why I pick up the Bible, then put it back down.
posted on September 21, 2001 01:49:06 PM
"A self serving, shrieking, yelling preacher to get fools all worked up who equate emotion with sincerity. The kind who run back and forth in front of the camera sweating and grimacing - in other words an actor."
Gravid, I don't think so. I was familiar with his work but NOT his "visions". He isn't a TV preacher. He is a small town preacher that after seeing an article in Time?Life magazine about NY gangs, left his small town and went to work in the getto. That was early 70's. He was one who sat nights with drug addicts going through witdrawal and told them that God values them. It in time grew to worldwide youth programs that are highly thought of for their unselfish work. He is known for his his very successful (troubled) youth programs that rise out of handfull of change and little else aside from humbleness and love and the word of God. I don't think he is a "office counselor" but a "street worker". He is 70 now.
His did write a lot of books and I have only read a few. From what I have seen, his teaching is Biblically based...but then I just got wind of his "visions". I don't like to discount that anyone CAN have a vision...but I am a skeptic always. I don't have any personally so far.
Perhaps we EACH have a fault of some sort and his happens to be questionable visions? Possible I guess.
I was just a little shocked by his "visions" because of his reputation for his work.
T
