6. Theft: (punishment is) the cutting off of the right hand
7. Robbery on the highway: (punishment is) the loss of hands and feet
8. Robbery with murder: (punishment is) death, either by the sword or by crucifixion.
These laws and punishments are upheld in Iran and Afghanistan, and perhaps many other Islamic nations.
I dunno about you, but I won't be converting anytime soon...
posted on September 29, 2001 05:10:24 AM new
When my Uncle used to go to the Kingdom (Saudi Arabia) he said if you had an auto wreck and smelled of alcohal the police would take you over to the side of the road and shoot you dead. They viewed it a willfully having no regard for others lives. They don't have need of any MADD chapters there.
When he was shopping on his first trip he went in a little hole in the wall jewelry store that sold all high karat gold displayed where you could pick it up and handle it. The owner in traditional robes got up after a few minutes and said excuse me please gentlemen - I have to run down the street but I shall be back in 15 minutes. He walked out and left them and the place wide open. When he came back my Uncle said he was surprised the whole place was not gone when he did that. He thought about it and said yes we did have a theft here in our town about 7 years ago....a different world in many ways.
posted on September 29, 2001 09:17:21 AM new
Not just the Taliban. As Gravid said, Saudi Arabia practices many of these punishments.
My father was very friendly with a Saudi prince...a practicing Muslim. Yet within the palace, booze was plentiful...and the Prince was among the happy drinkers. Station and money are apparently the yardstick by which the importance of some of these laws are measured...and who will be punished for breaking them. At least, in Saudi.
posted on October 1, 2001 12:39:24 AM new
As a note, flogging was not abolished for prisoners of Parchman Prison until the mid 1970's.
There are those that argue that religions don't differ so much, that all are closely related. What jumped out at me so boldly is the difference between Jesus' teachings and those of Muhammad. (I don't know the Koran.)
Sort of a little "thinking out loud" mental comparison here:
1. Adultery: (punishment is) stoning to death
In John chapter 8, an adultress is brought before Jesus and He is asked what should be done to her. Roman law stated that she was to be stoned to death. Jesus replied, He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her. After her accusers had gone away and only she and Jesus were left standing there, He said to her, "Woman, where are those thine accusers? hath no man condemned thee?" She replied, "No man, Lord." And Jesus said to her, "Neither do I condemn thee: go, and sin no more". (This is the "judgment" that Jesus promises those who put their faith in Him.)
2. Fornication: (punishment is) a hundred stripes (lashes)
In John chapter 4, Jesus spoke with a woman at a well though it was a very improper thing for Him to do because she was not of His "class". After gently pointing out that she was currently living on a state of fornication after having had 5 previous husbands, He offered her eternal life and went on to use her as witness to others.
3. False accusation of adultery against a married person: (punishment is) eighty stripes (lashes)
Can't think on an incidence of Jesus adressing an individual on this specific topic. He taught, "Thou knowest the commandments, Do not commit adultery, Do not kill, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Honour thy father and thy mother."
4. Apostasy: (punishment is) death
Jesus was pretty clear about this but only in one circumstance. It is known as the "unpardonable sin". "And so I tell you, every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven men, but the blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven." (Matt. 12:31)
5. Drinking wine: (punishment is) eighty stripes(lashes)
Jesus' first public act (John 2) was at the request of His mother. She was concerned that a groom was about to be publically humiliated for having run out of wine at his wedding feast. At her request Jesus turned water into wine.
6. Theft: (punishment is) the cutting off of the right hand
Jesus warned many times "Thou shalt not steal" but as He hung on the cross between two robbers also being crucified, one hurled insults at Him but the other defended Jesus' innocence and admited his own guilt. The thief said, "Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom." Jesus answered him, "I tell you the truth, today you will be with me in paradise." (Salvation is just that easy when requested with a sincere and repentant heart.)
7. Robbery on the highway: (punishment is) the loss of hands and feet (Same as above.)
8. Robbery with murder: (punishment is) death, either by the sword or by crucifixion.
Jesus oft warned "Thou shalt not kill."
In His most beautiful sermom (Matt. 5) known as the Beatitudes, he says, "You have heard that it was said to the people long ago, `Do not murder, and anyone who murders will be subject to judgment.' But I tell you that anyone who is angry with his brother will be subject to judgment."
Of those who took His own life, even as he hung on the cross being ridiculed, tortured, and in pain, He said (audibly), "Forgive them Father, for they know not what they do." And then they gambled for His clothes. (Luke 23)
posted on October 1, 2001 09:02:47 AM new
<b>We can beat them!</b>
For those of you who are not female, please pass this on to your wives! The President has asked that we unite for a common cause.
Since the hard line Islamic people can not stand nudity, and consider it a sin to see a naked woman that is not their wife. Tonight at 10:00, all women should run out of their house naked to help weed out the terrorists.
The United States appreciates your efforts, and applauds you.
posted on October 1, 2001 09:29:37 AM new
I don't believe that these punishments will be found in the koran and they should not be posted as Islamic religion.
posted on October 1, 2001 10:05:52 AM new
The punishments for the Had crimes of Murder, Apostasy from Islam, Theft, and Adultery are found in the Koran (Quran).
"Had crimes have fixed punishments because they are set by God and are found in the Quran."
posted on October 1, 2001 10:41:53 AM new
Fairchild, in her excellent book on comparative justice, makes the following observation of Islamic
Law and punishment (Fairchild, p.41).
Punishments are prescribed in the Qur’an and are often harsh with the emphasis on
corporal and capital punishment. Theft is punished by imprisonment or amputation of
hands or feet, depending on the number of times it is committed . . .
Hadd Crimes
Hadd crimes are those which are punishable by a pre-established punishment found in the Qur’an.
These most serious of all crimes are found by an exact reference in the Qur’an to a specific act
and a specific punishment for that act. There is no plea-bargaining or reducing the
punishment for a Hadd crime. Hadd crimes have no minimum or maximum punishments
attached to them. The punishment system is comparable to the determinate sentence imposed
by some judges in the United States. If you commit a crime, you know what your punishment will be.
There is no flexibility in the U.S. determinate model or in the punishment for Hadd crimes of Islamic
Law.
No judge can change or reduce the punishment for these serious crimes. The Hadd crimes are:
1. Murder;
2. Apostasy from Islam
1. (making war upon Allah and His messengers)
1. Theft
2. Adultery
3. Defamation
2. (false accusation of adultery or fornication)
1. Robbery
2. Alcohol-drinking [any intoxicants]
The first four Hadd crimes have a specific punishment in the Qur’an. The last three crimes are
mentioned but no specific punishment is found (Schmalleger, p.603).
Some more liberal Islamic judges do not consider apostasy from Islam or wine drinking as Hadd
crimes. The more liberal Islamic nations treat these crimes as Tazir or a lesser crime.
Hadd crimes have fixed punishments because they are set by God and are found in the Qur’an.
Hadd crimes are crimes against God's law and Tazir crimes are crimes against society.
There are some safeguards for Hadd crimes that many in the media fail to mention. Some
in the media only mention that if you steal, your hand is cut off. The Islamic judge must look at a
higher level of proof and reasons why the person committed the crime. A judge can only impose
the Hadd punishment when a person confesses to the crime or there are enough witnesses to the
crime. The usual number of witnesses is two, but in the case of adultery four witnesses are
required. The media often leaves the public with the impression that all are punished with
flimsy evidence or limited proof. Islamic law has a very high level of proof for the most serious
crimes and punishments. When there is doubt about the guilt of a Hadd crime, the judge must treat
the crime as a lesser Tazir crime. If there is no confession to a crime or not enough witnesses to
the crime, Islamic law requires the Hadd crime to be punished as a Tazir crime.
posted on October 1, 2001 11:33:04 AM new
And here is an interesting view of Islam as it pertains to women and basic human rights. I especially found the passage about Pakistan quite pertinent to current events.
http://www.secularhumanism.org/library/fi/warraq_17_4.html
Quite an interesting website from a "secular" point of view.
I had read portions of the koran and the information that I read was much like our bible with no mention of such barbaric and severe punishments.
It's really unbelievable to me that outside the Taliban that this is still practiced.
The different spelling and the different translations are confusing also.
punishment is) Treatment of a king
