posted on October 12, 2004 05:01:06 PM
I was wondering awhile back about your sig line, and just today asked someone what the 180 meant. Its full disclosure of all military records.
I'm surprised. I know you all can say that Bush was AWOL, got preferential treatment etc. Bush isn't using the Guard service in his campaign. But the thing about Kerry NOT releasing his military record is this: From the beginning, his 'platform' has been 'his service in Vietnam' even in the debates, he mentions how he served his country. He uses his military expierence all the time in his campaign
That is why I'm surprised, if he is using his military service, why not disclose his entire military record.
BUT with that being said, I, myself personally don't care what he did or didn't do in Vietnam... What I don't like (personally) is him coming back and being the 'leader' of an anti war group while his 'fellow' soldiers etc were still there, or just coming back.
Mike knew about him from back then. He served, in the Air Force then, and he honestly remembers him doing the anti war thing, and he did not like it at all.
posted on October 12, 2004 05:49:02 PM
NearTheSea - While you're waiting for bear to answer I want to put in my two cents.
I personally believe, from everything I've read that kerry's not willing to sign the 180 because of his second trip to Paris when he was still a commissioned officer. He shouldn't have done that and if his records were opened that is one thing that might be seen.
But also, all his supposed band aid wounds would be exposed for the scratches they were. Makes him look more than a little silly to be using scratches to get out of a 14 week stint in VN when most served at least one year there.
Anyway..I'll post part of what some have planned for kerry on 11-3-04. It ought to raise just a few 'hen' feathers around here.
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"And they, the interrogator went through all of these statements from John Kerry. He starts pounding on the table. 'See here, this naval officer, he admits that you are a criminal.'" Excerpt from "Stolen Honor"
- James H. Warner
Former Vietnam POW
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"I will never submit America's national security to an international test. The use of troops to defend America must never be subject to a veto by countries like France. The President's job is not to take an international poll -- the President's job is to defend America." --President George W. Bush
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
Re-elect President Bush
posted on October 12, 2004 05:56:30 PM
Here it is....we'll have to wait and see if anything comes of it or not. But I'm hopeful as I'd bet are most VN vets who oppose kerry.
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Appeal for Indictment of John Kerry Completed
DATE: 12 October 2004
CAMPAIGN UPDATE:
The Petition for Indictment of John Kerry reached its target of 150,000 signatures in September. (This petition for indictment will remain online for informational purposes [see http://patriotpetitions.us/, and will accept additional signatures, which we will report each quarter after the petition for indictment is filed.)
Dear Fellow Patriot,
The petition for indictment of John Kerry, for "giving aid and comfort to the enemy," and, thus, to disqualify him for national office, has reached its goal of more than 150,000 signatures. On Monday, 18 October, the petition will be delivered by registered courier to Vice President Richard Cheney (in his capacity as Senate President), Senate Majority Leader Bill Frist and Attorney General John Ashcroft today.
Though John Kerry has an extensive and well-documented record of anti-American activities over the past three decades [see "John Kerry: More aid and comfort..." at http://FederalistPatriot.US/alexander/, it is his acts of treason in 1970-71 that are the subject of this petition for indictment.
Our appeal notes both Kerry's violations of the UCMJ (Article 104 part 904) and U.S. Code (18 USC Sec. 2381 and 18 USC Sec. 953), and calls for his disqualification for public office in accordance with the Constitution's Fourteenth Amendment, Section 3, which states: "No person shall be a Senator or Representative in Congress, or elector of President and Vice- President ... having previously taken an oath ... to support the Constitution of the United States, [who has] engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the same, or given aid or comfort to the enemies thereof."
Why prosecute John Kerry now?
[b]In October 2003, Mr. Kerry chose to make his Vietnam war record the centerpiece of his campaign for the presidency; this has been especially true since his primary victory in March 2004 [see "Kerry's Quagmire..." http://FederalistPatriot.US/alexander/.
In response, more than 165,000 signatories of the above-referenced petition for indictment have made his war record the centerpiece of their campaign to disqualify Kerry from public office.
We understand that no action is likely to be taken on this petition until after the 02 November election. Be it known, however, that on 03 November, we will seek full recourse in an effort to have John Kerry prosecuted for acts of treason and disqualified from any future campaign for any national office. We are thus committed to holding Mr. Kerry accountable for his actions, as there is no statute of limitations for acts of treason.
Thank you for taking the time to sign this petition for indictment. Rest assured that your voice will be heard.
Semper Vigilo, Paratus, et Fidelis!
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posted on October 12, 2004 07:35:35 PM
Near, three reasons why kerry will not sign the 180 form. 1. Date he received his Honorable discharge 2. The V for valor on his Silver Star. 3. Release of the base to ship radio transcripts and ship to ship..
posted on October 12, 2004 08:57:32 PM
Linda, Have been very busy with local & county elections. My lovley lady and I are doing well.
Most military people worth their salt understand why kerry won't sign the 180.
As commanding officer of his boat, he is the only one that can release the ship to base, base to ship transcripts & ship to ship transcripts. These are communications by radio of all combat actions he was in during his tour.
It would also release if he was given a General discharge which was later up to Honorable. I have checked his ribbons. He has no good Conduct Medal. Does not add up with an Honorable Discharge.
President Bush, received the Good Conduct Medal. Had enough points in 5.4 years of service that equaled to 19yrs of service toward retirement in the National Guard.
That is the first that I have heard about Bush being presented the Good Conduct Medal. Since you have stated incorrect information here before, I find this hard to believe. Can you offer a link to verify that information?
Oh, I see...You must be referring to George H W Bush...NOT Bush jr.
posted on October 12, 2004 09:59:28 PM
That's a very straightforward statement, yellowstone. I suggest you pick up a history book and read about it if you aren't aware of Kerry's successful contribution toward ending the Vietnam war.
posted on October 12, 2004 10:23:52 PM
Helen
The only thing that I see as being successful is your evasion of my post.
And that after you said to Fred; Can you offer a link to verify that information?
So I guess I am left with using your statement, again to Fred; No, Fred I'll just disbelieve your information since you can't back it up. So Helen, since YOU can't back it up I choose to disbelieve you.
posted on October 13, 2004 06:48:52 AM
Yellowstone, you asked me to explain my statement, "I am most impressed that Kerry played such a significant role in ending the Vietnam war."
What about that statement do you not understand. Since you bolded "significant role" you must question the fact that Kerry played a significant role. I see that after I went to bed, you suggested that you can't believe that I have that opinion without a link so I will provide a link for you this morning. The truth is that Kerry distinguished himself by representing the overwhelming majority of Vietnam vets. His leadership of the Vietnam Veterans Against the War and his testimony before the Senate Foreign Relations Committee helped to end that losing battle. Later, he worked with John McCain and Clinton to normalize our relations with Vietnam.
posted on October 13, 2004 01:07:46 PM
I read the speech, it doesn't really convince me that he played a significant role in ending the war in Vietnam, but that wasn't what I had asked about.
But that wasn't my question, it was why he won't release his military records
The 180 as its called
Hi Linda nice to see you all
We have been super busy lately, so I don't come here a lot, but when I do, I read most everything.
Thanks Linda, I had heard he had met with communist leaders in Paris. Fred, as always, thank you for your posts, they are always thought out well. Are you running for an office, or working with the elections committee?
Well, another debate tonight, I think its on at 6pm PST, I hope thats right!
posted on October 13, 2004 05:52:07 PM
Some may remember a post I shared a while back about kerry's three commanding officers being happy to get him state-side again....they felt he was a danger to others and wasn't following the rules.
Well...we might still be hearing more about why kerry won't sign the 180. This is from today's WSJ:
Honorable Discharge?
In today's New York Sun, Thomas Lipscomb reports on the latest mystery involving the Vietnam service of John Kerry, who by the way served in Vietnam:
An official Navy document on Senator Kerry's campaign Web site listed as Mr. Kerry's "Honorable Discharge from the Reserves" opens a door on a well-kept secret about his military service.
The document is a form cover letter in the name of the Carter administration's secretary of the Navy, W. Graham Claytor. It describes Mr. Kerry's discharge as being subsequent to the review of "a board of officers." This in itself is unusual. There is nothing about an ordinary honorable discharge action in the Navy that requires a review by a board of officers.
According to the secretary of the Navy's document, the "authority of reference" this board was using in considering Mr. Kerry's record was "Title 10, U.S. Code Section 1162 and 1163." This section refers to the grounds for involuntary separation from the service.
What was being reviewed, then, was Mr. Kerry's involuntary separation from the service. And it couldn't have been an honorable discharge, or there would have been no point in any review at all.
The review was likely held to improve Mr. Kerry's status of discharge from a less than honorable discharge to an honorable discharge.
A Kerry campaign spokesman, David Wade, was asked whether Mr. Kerry had ever been a victim of an attempt to deny him an honorable discharge. [i]AGAIN[/b] There has been no response to that inquiry.
In the absence of an explanation from the Kerry camp, Lipscomb offers some speculation:
There are a number of categories of discharges besides honorable. There are general discharges, medical discharges, bad conduct discharges, as well as other than honorable and dishonorable discharges.
There is one odd coincidence that gives some weight to the possibility that Mr. Kerry was dishonorably discharged. Mr. Kerry has claimed that he lost his medal certificates and that is why he asked that they be reissued.
But when a dishonorable discharge is issued, all pay benefits, and allowances, and all medals and honors are revoked as well. And five months after Mr. Kerry joined the U.S. Senate in 1985, on one single day, June 4, all of Mr. Kerry's medals were reissued.
We're not sure what to make of all this, but certainly the story of John Kerry and Vietnam is more nuanced than the simple tale of heroism he sold his party and is trying to sell the country.
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Only three weeks left....maybe this will be the October surprise the dems have been so worried about????
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NearTheSea - My DIL is getting bigger and bigger by the week. They're so excited and it rubs off on me. I'm making new matching drapes, blankets and bedspread for their room. It's SO much fun.
Let us know when your bundle of joy is delivered please.
posted on October 13, 2004 06:05:57 PM
And the cowardly yellow-bellied, drunk Geo. W Bush did NOT have the courage to fight at all.
What a putrid slime bag to be so willing to send others to war when he was too cowardly to go himself....even snorting coke didn't give him courage....he was so lacking !!!!!!
Excerpt from "Stolen Honor"
