posted on September 10, 2000 09:05:09 AM new
We have all heard a great deal about paypal, but I thought it would be interesting to get your perspectives and/or experiences with other payment services. I have started to offer a few others in an attempt to maximize the number of electronic payments I get from my customers because I hate manual checks and not everyone has a paypal account. Unfortunately there are a lot of them out there: some good, some bad. Below is a list of services that I have either used or heard about (My customers tend to use paypal and paydirect a lot). If you know of any others, please let me know along with your experiences. It will be interesting to know if the fee-based systems provide much benefit over the free ones.
Brief Experience:
paypal.com:
Clear leader in its space. Feature rich. Relatively rapid money transfers. Newest "instant add" feature is innovative.
paydirect.com:
Nice interface and also feature rich. Money deposits to checking accounts take over 5 business days, however.
moneyzap.com:
Can send money by credit or checking account, but transfer is not instant like paypal or paydirect. Transfer time on the order of 3-5 days.
payplace.com:
Limited features, but rapid movement of payments to checking account. Heavy focus on security prevents some legitimite customers from using service.
eMoneyMail.com:
Probably the fastest money transfer service I have used if you get money sent to you via credit card and then deposit into a checking account, but they charge a $1 fee and only allow you to transfer up to $300 per day so it really does not work for more expensive auctions.
payme.com:
Limited features and very long times to get money out of system (I have experienced over 2 week delays in some cases).
X.com:
Only system I know that pays interest on balances, but then again it is a bank account. Permits very rapid outbound transfers to other bank accounts that you may link.
[ edited by palmerrs on Nov 3, 2000 06:34 PM ]
posted on September 11, 2000 10:10:02 AM new
You left out ecount, another free service using credit cards. They mail you checks which take about a week to show up.
I strongly recommend against using Payme. A customer ordered a $600 item from me and I ordered it from my supplier. He paid me and I paid my supplier with Payme. I thought this would minimize my outlay because the charge on my card would be covered by the credit from my customer's payment. Well, my card got charged right away. TWO MONTHS later I had still not been paid. Payme claimed my customer's account was being investigated for fraud. I had two problems with this. 1) This was not my first dealing with this customer and previous transactions and some made afterward with other service had all gone through. 2) This excuse is good for a few days, but they were still investigating TWO MONTHS later..?
Then my supplier calls to say MY payment, which I had already paid my CC company, had not been paid to him because payme said that MY account was being investigated for fraud! It took a complaint to the Banking Commission and a charge back of my payment to get Payme to make good. I was lied to every time I emailed or called ("your payment will go out tomorrow". I will never use them again.
posted on September 11, 2000 02:53:09 PM new
eCount.com is listed under the fee-based services because they recently started to charge fees to add and remove money from one's account ($1 per transaction). They used to allow you to credit your balance to a credit card or debit card, but they disabled that feature during the summer and now will only send you a check which in my mind defeats the whole convenience factor of using these services. Consequently ecount is not one of may favorites at this point. They do have good customer service, however.
As for payme.com, I have to agree with your assessment. It sounds like they think everyone is trying to commit fraud and are very effective at angering their customers. I also believe that they have some internal record keeping problems because when I sent a payment, they disabled my account without even telling me and even recharged my credit card for some payments I had made months ago. I finally rectified the situation after several calls and told them to keep my account disabled because, frankly, I have no further use for it.
posted on September 11, 2000 08:40:09 PM new
Hello -
My perception is that paypal is ahead of the competition on many fronts. For example, the recent "instant-add" feature (where you can instantly email money from your checking account if you have available credit on a credit card) is rather innovative. It is clear that paypal is constantly trying to innovate/improve the offering.
However, some payment services accept American Express and also let you move money out of your account via a credit to your credit or debit card in addition to transfer via ACH or manual check, but I am sure you are already aware of that. In addition, if paypal could integrate some type of escrow function into its service, it would have almost all (almost because competitors like ecount also offer a virtual charge card facility) the features of the competition but with a lower cost of use and (I think) a larger customer base which would be a powerful competitive force in the internet payment space...
[ edited by palmerrs on Sep 11, 2000 08:42 PM ]
posted on September 12, 2000 06:43:25 AM new
www.ccnow.com
Fee based. Kinda steep at 9% however no sign up requirement for buyers. Shopping cart for websites. You can send auction invoices out with it. Pretty nice Basically your own merchant account with out the physical termainal and all those merchant set up monthy gateway etc etc etc fees
E-commerce only. I've been really happy with them .....However 9%fee on transactions. (8% Nov-Dec)
If I could only get paypal to install a shopping cart.
Forgot to add INTERNATIONAL acceptance. And you can accept visa MC Discover and Amex.
[ edited by Pandoras_Trinkets on Sep 12, 2000 06:46 AM ]
posted on September 12, 2000 10:25:12 AM new
Hi Pandora's Trinkets,
The shopping cart function will be available very, very shortly. In addition, there will be international, debit cards,etc. Our feature line-up to assist buyers and sellers will be impressive
posted on September 13, 2000 08:10:14 AM new
TheRedCircle & VICTORIA -
I think it is appropriate to leave paypal in the "free" category for the time being as their personal account, with many of the same features of the competition, is in fact free.
Granted, there are some features that cost money with the business account but since paypal allows you to maintain both a personal and business account, you can always use the free aspect if you need to.
yisgood -
If you try to add or withdrawal money from eCount, they will charge you a $1 fee. It is now part of the add/withdrawal form -- at least that is what my account is telling me.
posted on September 13, 2000 08:17:52 AM new
palmerrs: Thanks for the info, I just saw it. This is even sneakier than Paypal. I read all the info on ecount and they keep saying "free, free, free." No mention of the fees until you actually try to use it. This means that if a customer tries to pay me $5 for something, it will cost them $1 and cost me $1. Pretty good scam. I had my doubts about ecount right from the start. They offered $10 back if you made your first transaction by 8/31. So I posted in my auctions "pay with ecount and get $10 back." Then in midstream they changed it to "spend $30 with one of their vendors and get $10 back." I dont know if anyone ever got the $10. I know I didnt and none of my customers did and we all followed their original offer. I did receive a few ecount payments and they went through smoothly and I wasnt charged for them, but this new change really takes the cake. Don't these sites realize that if you try to fool people, they wont trust you with their money?
posted on September 13, 2000 09:05:26 AM new
So which system is the best? I thought it might be useful to discuss some metrics. The following seem to be key considerations for these internet payment systems and are based on my personal experience. If you have additional/better information, let us know:
Speed of Payment (i.e., How fast do I have access to my money in business days)
eCount: Immediate
Paypal/X: Immediate
Payplace: Immediate
Paydirect: Immediate
eMoneyMail: 2-4 Days (passthrough acct)
MoneyZap: 3-7 Days (passthrough acct)
Payme: Over 7 Days (passthrough acct)
Speed of Withdrawal (i.e., How long does it take to get my money out of the system or transfer to my checking acct in business days)
X: ~ 1-2 Days
Paypal: ~ 3 Days
Paydirect: ~ 7 Days
eCount: ~ 10-14 Days
Payplace: ~ 14 Days
eMoneyMail: N/A
MoneyZap: N/A
Payme: N/A
Payment Options (i.e., Ways to fund my account or send payment)
Paydirect: ACH, MasterCard, Visa, Discover, Amex
MoneyZap: ACH, MasterCard, Visa, Discover, Amex
X: ACH
Paypal: ACH, MasterCard, Visa
Payplace: MasterCard, Visa, Discover
eCount: MasterCard, Visa, Discover
eMoneyMail: Visa, eCheck
Payme: MasterCard, Visa
Withdrawal Options (i.e., Ways to get my money out of the system)
eMoneyMail: ACH, Credit/Debit Card, Manual Check
X: ACH, Debit Card, Manual Check
Paydirect: ACH, Credit/Debit Card
Paypal: ACH, Manual Check
Payplace: ACH, Manual Check
MoneyZap: ACH
Payme: ACH
eCount: Manual Check, Credit Card
posted on September 13, 2000 09:17:22 AM new
Another factor in the equation: How quickly do you know that you are sending/getting the money and how accurate is the information? What if sender makes a mistake?
Paypal: you get an immediate email but you better double check because email ID errors can cause problems and people have forged fake PP emails. If sent to the wrong ID and it IS a valid PP account, sender can not cancel. If not a valid account, sender can cancel. This will continue to cause problems until Paypal stops making excuses and does something to correct this. A number of good suggestions have already been posted.
Payme, Ecount, Payplace, Paydirect: you get an immediate email and you have to claim the money, so there should be no problems. Sender can cancel the payment if unclaimed.(Though a number of folks have claimed that Paydirect did not send them the email, yet the money was in their account. This seems to be a typical Yahoo problem.)
Moneyzap: Someone paid me Sat nite and forwarded the confirmation email they got. I have yet to receive notification as of Wed.
Payme took over TWO MONTHS to pay a vendor who I paid through them, though they charged my card immediately. They took over a month to pay me, though they charged my buyer's card immediately. During this time they informed me that my buyer's account was being investigated for fraud and informed my seller that my account was being investigated for fraud. Both statements were untrue.
posted on September 14, 2000 07:43:07 PM new
I can also vouch for CCNow. I use them on my website, and have been a client for close to a year now. They're not cheap, but the service is outstanding and they have a lot of nice features (love the shopping cart!). You can sell internationally too, and there's a special page just for collecting auction payments.
They don't pay instantly; it's every 2 weeks, but they've paid me on time, every time. You can be paid by check (which is what I use) or direct deposit. They do pay interest as well.
posted on September 15, 2000 08:20:06 AM new
One more to add to the list - CheckSpace (www.checkspace.com)
Our transaction fee is .95 cents for each transaction received - but you get the first 5 transactions every month for free. And, for each new member you refer, you get $10 in transaction fee credits.
-Speed of payment = 1-3 days
-Speed of withdrawal = N/A - money goes into your existing bank account
-Payment Options = ACH
-Withdrawal Options - N/A - money goes into your existing bank account
-Transaction Limits - $500/week to start. You can raise this to $10,000/week
-Available Icons for web sites - Yes
-International - No
-Payor/Payee registration - Yes, both parties must be CheckSpace members
posted on September 16, 2000 11:58:19 AM new
I noticed on another thread that someone mentioned Exchangepath.com I went to this site and it is another place to send or accept money from auctions for FREE. I was impressed at how fast my sign up email was sent to me and the process to sign up was quick and easy.
You can accept Credit/Debit Cards and all major credit cards are accepted. That includes Visa, Mastercard, American Express, Discover, and a few other ones. This might be somewhat more convenient for buyers and sellers.
This site looks very promising and I am going to be adding it to all of my auctions. I am not going to be accepting Paypal anymore and paying their unfair fees.
I have checked out about 10 other services for CC payments in the last 2 days and no others compare to this one.
I thought that I had no other choice but to accept Paypal and their fees, but I have found out differently.
Check it out and see what you think.
The site is www.exchangepath.com
Wish that I could put a link to the website on here, but I am unsure of how to do this.
posted on September 16, 2000 01:42:09 PM new
I just checked out exchangepath.com and it does look promising but their terms of service are somewhat confusing. They seem to address only the buyers side of the transaction even though the overview clearly states it is acceptable for auction sellers to use. You have to request information on Merchant accounts so it is not available to read online. I wonder if it will make a distinction between types of auction sellers.
On the sellers info page, it says withdrawls can be made either to a credit, debit card or to a checking account. I like the idea of having funds credited directly to my debit card instead of having to provide actual checking account information. But in the TOS, it says that account balances cannot be used to pay down existing credit card debt. Isn't that what would happen if you withdrew funds by having them applied to a credit card?
Also looks like auction buyers are limited to $200 a day in transactions.
posted on September 16, 2000 03:31:08 PM new
Hopefulli
What is the maximum I can send?
You may send a maximum of $200 per transaction up to $1000 per day. There is no limit to the amount you can receive.
This came straight from Exchangepath's site.
I have not used this service yet but I like the idea that there are so many credit cards that we can accept. We are not limited to just Visa and Mastercard.
I have added their logo to all of my auctions and intend on adding a phrase to my auctions about Exchangepath so that way it will be searchable on Ebay.
I had a previous thread under the Ebay Outlook about Exchangepath.com but it seems to have disappeared.
posted on September 16, 2000 04:20:07 PM new
I recently signed up with exchangepath.com to send a personal payment to a family member. It appears to work well. I was able to send more than $200 by simply making a couple of payments so I don't understand the rationale for that limitation other than to make sure someone does not type a large number accidently. The thing one has to be careful about is if you send to the wrong email address you cannot correct it -- unclaimed money will be returned in 30 days if the address does not exist and they state that they are not responsible for payment to the wrong address. I have noticed with paydirect you always have to accept the money so wrong addresses can be corrected.
The site is currently offering a $10 sign-up bonus and $5 referral bonus which is also kind of nice. I have also been listing it in my auctions. No takers yet, though.
posted on September 16, 2000 04:24:07 PM new
Thanks VSassy, I did notice the $1,000/day max. I was thinking more along the lines of the maximum amount that any one buyer would be able to send me in a day. That amount appears to be $200. It wouldn't work for the higher end items unless split up between days (if that is allowed?), but would probably be a viable alternative for a lot sellers (me included on many items). I did sign up but haven't added it to any auctions yet.
posted on September 24, 2000 05:12:28 PM new
Thumbs up on ExchangePath so far. Fast and easy to use and money is credited to your checking account in about 4 business days if you want to withdrawal it from the system. They do limit withdrawals to $500 per calendar day so if you have large transactions that you want in your bank account it could be a bit of a pain.
They appear to take almost every type of credit card as well and don't charge any fees for the service (at least not yet).
Can't speak to customer service quality yet as I have not needed to use them.
posted on September 29, 2000 09:11:35 AM new
Payplace has recently changed their withdrawal policies. You can now only withdrawal up to $200 in a 90 day period and it takes about 2 weeks to get the money at that. This is not a particularly good situation. It has just fallen off my list of useful services...
posted on September 29, 2000 10:52:06 AM new"You can now only withdrawal up to $200 in a 90 day period and it takes about 2 weeks to get the money at that"
I'm not doubting you, but could you provide a link to that rule. Either I'm not understanding it or they've shut the door on any significant amount of funds you can receive.
posted on September 29, 2000 04:35:38 PM new
uaru:
Under the HELP tab:
What is the maximum amount I can withdraw from my PayPlace account?
You may withdraw your full amount from your PayPlace account, if you are requesting that we send you a check. However, $200 is the maximum you can electronically transfer from PayPlace to your bank account within a 90-day period.
I should have clarified: The withdrawal limit applies to electronic transfers. Still, they have made it very inconvenient to withdrawal money.
posted on September 30, 2000 04:43:34 AM new
That's wierd. Me personally I don't want to get checks in the mail, I've always gone for electronic transfer when ever possible, my employer, broker, social security, all get money to me via direct deposits. Why on earth would PayPlace encourage people to use 'paper checks'???
posted on September 30, 2000 07:59:38 PM new
Exchangepath works great, I had one bidder to pay through there I transfered my money to my debit card and it showed up in my bank within 2 days. also I have emailed customer service about some of there policys and they are quick to respond,
posted on October 2, 2000 03:13:54 PM new
goldmanx:
As posted earlier, I think it is appropriate to leave paypal in the "free" category for the time being as their personal account, with many of the same features of the competition, is in fact free.
Granted, there are some features that cost money with the business account but since paypal allows you to maintain both a personal and business account, you can always use the free aspect if you need to. Also, the competition is not as feature rich as paypal at this stage so to mark them as fee-based would be inequitable.
. I will never use them again.