posted on February 28, 2003 10:33:56 AM new
Each one of my Store items has an HTML description and within that description I have my own tailored Meta Tags that include description and keywords. (these have been tested and are optimized for search engines).
I have also submitted my Store site URL to numerous search engines.
QUESTION: Are the web's search engine's web-crawlers, bots and spiders allowed access to the level that my embedded Meta Tags are located within my Store?
Or are the search engines only able to read the Store template page?
I realize it is impossible for the search engines to search and dig through each item, but it would be great if there was a place on our main Store page to enter our own tailored Meta Tag info in order to draw more buyers. Something more than the TEXT only description and keywords that can be entered on the Store Wizard... that's not sufficient. (Better than nothing though!)
I understand all about the daily feed to Froogle - and that is great... but I don't understand if my Meta Tags are feeding to Froogle or anywhere for that matter.
I appreciate any information regarding this.
Thanks!
Greg Williams
Retro Bargains
www.retrobargains.com
[ edited by RetroBargains on Feb 28, 2003 10:36 AM ]
posted on February 28, 2003 10:39:35 AM new
Hi Greg,
Your store should not be limited in terms of searching for meta tags. What is it that you were looking for, regarding tailored Meta Tags? Let me know, I'd be happy to pass the suggestions you give along to Product Development for future versions of stores.
posted on February 28, 2003 11:09:14 AM new
Thanks Sonya,
Well from studying how search engines work, they (the bots, spiders and crawlers) read from top down only on one page (the one submitted to the search engines).
Based on key information in the META TAGS the bots, spiders and crawlers "read" the page looking for relevancy... any errors they find and content info can make a bot or spider STOP reading the page - results are devastating for your ranking when someone is using the search engine.
Basically, errors kill your chance to be seen. No meta tag information kills your chances as do poor meta tags (such as the limitations we now have on entering only our Store description and a few keywords). What we are doing is not allowing our stores to be as visible as they could be.
SUGGESTION: On the Store Wizard, place an Advanced Meta Tag window that allows more than 255 characters for those of us that use Meta Tags to place our PRIMARY Meta Tag in. This would place our information where the bots and spiders would "see" it and get our Stores out where they can be seen better!
An added benefit would be to add one of the simple Meta Tag creator programs to the Store Wizard so that EVERYONE using stores can move AuctionWatch Stores to a more visible level. Froogle is great, but why not take as much of the pie as we can??
EXAMPLE: Here is my Meta Tag Info that I have in my HTML for each item in my store:
==========================================
<head>
<meta name="resource-type" content="document">
<meta name="generator" content="Microsoft FrontPage 4.0">
<meta http-equiv="pragma" content="no-cache">
<meta name="revisit-after" content="15 days">
<meta name="classification" content="General Merchandise">
<meta name="description" content="Retro Bargains Books, Bargains & Collectibles offers discount prices on used merchandise. Great gift ideas! Great bargains! Free Shipping on our large collection of vintage magazine advertisements. Ads are original and ready to frame. No Reproductions or copies!">
<meta name="keywords" content=",ad,ads,advertise,advertisement,vintage,books,bargains,collectables,collectibles,retro,old,antique,retrobargains,magazine">
<meta name="robots" content="ALL">
<meta name="distribution" content="Global">
<meta name="rating" content="General">
<meta name="copyright" content="2003 Retro Bargains">
<meta name="author" content="Greg Williams">
<meta http-equiv="reply-to" content="[email protected]">
<meta name="language" content="English">
<meta name="doc-type" content="Web Page"">
<meta name="doc-class" content="Living Document">
<meta name="doc-rights" content="Copywritten Work">
<TITLE>Retro Bargains Vintage Books, Bargains & Collectibles</TITLE>
</head>
IN CONTRAST - Here is all that bots and Spiders are "seeing" CURRENTLY when my StoreFront URL is tested at Spider View Keyword Density Analyzer (http://bobmin.newqd.iuinc.com/cgi-bin/spiderview_da.pl)
The "spider" gave up before ever getting down deep enough to see and file my real Meta Tag Information that would promote my items to the greater number of people.
Meta tags are an art, but an easy art with the right tools - hopefully development will place those tools for us.
Thanks!
Greg Williams
Retro Bargains
www.retrobargains.com
posted on February 28, 2003 12:10:36 PM new
The meta tags you have now are fine.That is all you really need.Ive looked into this.Yahoo stores have the same system and our search engine rank is almost always the first or second page.
Vey few search engines rank your site based on your meta tags.Here is a list of the search engines that dont....
1.Google
2.Aol Search
3.Yahoo! Search
4.Froogle
Here is a list that do..
1.Hot Bot
2.Lycos
3.MSN
These are basically the only real important search engines you need to be listed in.
If you want good rankings with Google you need to get listed in The Google Directory or the Yahoo! Directory before you do any submitting to search engines.Yahoo directory is 299.00 a year so Id just stick the google directory becouse its free.
Also try to get listed in as many product sites and directories as possible.Such as nerdworld,Ask Jeeves etc.It also helps tremendously to be linked to other websites listed on the web.That is what affiliate programs are for.The more sites the crawlers,bots and spiders find your site linked to,the more popular they assume you are.
Unfortunatley your not going to have to much luck getting listed with an Auctionwatch store.Trust me I have already spent hundreds of dollars and and been through the whole waiting process.I dont know why Auctionwatch stores cant be listed,but trust me IT CANT BE DONE.
posted on February 28, 2003 01:47:43 PM new
Thanks for the great info! I learned quickly that my domain forwarding also blocks bots and such. Even though my www.retrobargains.com redirects to my AuctionWatch storefront, my domain manager seems to block the bots from getting through.
Important thing to know for anyone else that is forwarding their domain to their store like I am - submitting my domain doesn't do diddly. have to submit the http://shop.auctionwatch.com/retrobargains URL to break past my domain manager's block.
That's no problem, since those using my domain are headed to my site anyway!
I'll take your advice and get my site listed in directories where I can.
Thanks!
Greg Williams
Retro Bargains
www.retrobargains.com
posted on February 28, 2003 01:51:57 PM new
Now see,your telling me things I didnt know now.When I submited my Auctionwatch store I submited my domain name url.That explains why I wasnt listed.Its a good thing Yahoo submits the url for you otherwise my yahoo store would of been rejected also
posted on February 28, 2003 03:23:10 PM new
I don't think it's the domain manager's fault when you think about it. Basically the only thing on the "page" for the redirect is the URL you are directing to... nothing for a bot to pull from really.
I didn't think anything about it until I was testing my HTML and Meta Tags and the spider test reported that nothing was found at my domain name.
That was an eye-opener.
That's what got me to thinking just what the bots are seeing at my "real" link - that's when I discovered the massive errors in code for the storefront and that bots and spiders weren't bothering to continue after hitting the errors - they figure it's a bad page and quit wasting their time.
Still waiting to hear from AW regarding the Meta Tag question... My guess is it is a sensitive area and someone doesn't have authority to answer or speculate otherwise regarding this crucial problem with the code in the storefronts and the ability for bots to get to our Meta Tags.
I figure there's money to be made by gating what bots can read at AW... money to be made from us store owners.
I could be wrong... but it seems like there is MORE money to be made by letting bots find our stores so that we sell more items and AW makes more money directly instead of indirectly.
But we all know it isn't always the sharpest crayon in the box that gets to draw the lines for the best picture.
Greg Williams
Retro Bargains
www.retrobargains.com
posted on March 1, 2003 09:26:07 AM new
Sonya,
Any update on the Meta Tag question? I understand you were going to forward this to Product Development - but the problem is the Product is already Developed and needs addressed currently.
Thanks,
Greg Williams
Retro Bargains
www.retrobargains.com
posted on March 1, 2003 10:42:57 AM new
Hello Greg,
We do not believe that the errors noted by the HTML validation tool you are using would cause a spider or bot to miss your listing. You can run virtually any web page through an HTML validator it is bound to come up with some errors.
posted on March 1, 2003 06:16:33 PM new
Hello Greg,
I did not mean to imply anything personal in my above post - I am sorry if you took it that way. We have looked at this, and we simply do not feel that the errors picked up by the HTML validator you are using would have any effect on spidering. We will take another look; however, from what we have seen the errors picked up are very minor.
posted on March 3, 2003 08:38:39 PM new
To quote General McAuliffe on his response to the German Army when they told him to surrender at Bastogne:
"NUTS!"
------------------
You'll have to resort to history to learn what I mean by that.
------------------
I accept your apology. And since you have "thoroughly" investigated my Meta Tag dilemna and there is absolutely NO way that the 22 "common" HTML syntax errors (found abundantly within my Storefront TEMPLATE - and everyone else's I'm sure) are blocking any attempts by spiders, crawlers and bots from reaching MY Meta Tags, I am open to any POSSIBLE reason as to the following:
1. I have had ZERO hits to my Storefront (just me).
2. I have had ZERO purchases in my Storefront.
3. I have had ZERO emails from my Storefront.
4. I have 150 DIFFERENT Items in my Storefront Inventory - EACH item has it's OWN specific set of Meta Tags hand-tailored to include KEYWORDS found in that items HTML description. EACH Item has at a minimum 4 or 5 KEYWORDS that are different than the REST of the items in inventory. MOST of my items have tailored keywords that range from 10 or 12 keywords.
AT BEST, help me to understand how a World Wide Web, with AuctionWatch feeds going direct to Froogle, cannot give me AT LEAST ONE LOUSY HIT on my Storefront with all of these keywords available?
I know it's small compared to some, but the numbers above collectively range anywhere from 600 to 1800 "different" Meta Tag Keywords and no one in the entire universe happens to be entering any of those COMMON words into a search engine? Give me a break.
I did check other web sites and web pages using various HTML validation tools. Most came up with ZERO HTML errors (way to go webmasters!) - Some came up with a few errors - but only ONE came up with 22 Errors and quit running due to TOO MANY ERRORS - That was the link for my Storefront.
So yes, I apologize that I have to STILL use a storefront template that was not quality tested before allowing paying customers to use it.
For that I am truly sorry.
Please help me to understand why no bots, spiders or crawlers are reaching my Keywords. I can enter one of those keywords in, even in froogle, and if it isn't in the TITLE or in my Storefront Welcome text, I don't show up... even in Froogle.
Guess there's nothing wrong on your end huh?
Greg Williams
Retro Bargains
www.retrobargains.com
posted on March 7, 2003 01:41:05 PM new
Greg: You are over my head and probably their's too. There is still a lot of work that needs to be done in the stores. My store is usually accessed from ebay. So the customer has to figure out how to reach the other 4000 items I have not on ebay. Keyword search??? No, not by the time they get in your store. Etcetera.....but, over time, AW is improving. If you ever get this straightened out with them we will all benefit, I know. THANKS
posted on March 7, 2003 05:04:04 PM new
Ya know folks, one thing to keep in mind is that this STORE only costs $5/month!
Really, it is nice for small-potatoes like me!
If you are a big commercial venture in need of extreme shopping cart set-ups & advanced search-engine placement, etc, there are a lot of web companies out there you will do you great.....
NOT for $5/month!
I think for what we pay, AW has done a STUPENDOUS job so far! NOT perfect, but far better than feeBay's feeble farce!
Ralphie loves Mr Blonde:
"Are you gonna bark all day little doggie, or are you gonna bite?" http://tinyurl.com/5duz
posted on March 7, 2003 07:57:59 PM new
baylor45: Thanks for the encouraging words. But actually if I am "over their heads"... they need new heads. <g>
tomwii: So you are saying it is "okay" to sell a substandard product that can be improved upon in a matter of seconds by any semi-competent HTML technician? No, that's not acceptable. I realize this isn't a perfect world (to my letdown) but we aren't talking rocket science here...(yes, I did that in the military)...we are talking "typical" Hyper-Text Markup Language (HTML) that is <gasp!> a basic requirement for a web-based company!! What this REALLY boils down to is poor Quality Control and proofreading of HTML code by AW. Granted, I've watched them come a long way, but for crying out loud... HTML "IS" their bread-and-butter!! By their OWN admission they stated above they FOUND "minor" errors! Excuse me... but ANY error of ANY kind in HTML is inexcusable...by ANYONE that KNOWS HTML.
Okay... I've been down this road before and I have seen, as many of you have, the "silent treatment" that AW gives an issue that they KNOW is a valid point but will REFUSE to acknowledge it. Mark my word, in the background techs will address the issue and on the forefront the issue will continue to be ignored. Without our knowledge and if we are "lucky" the "fix" will be placed and some new trigger will be publicly announced that suddenly increased your traffic to your store... and that "trigger" will be CORRECTED HTML code in the store templates!! But we will never know that. Can't blame AW - after all, would YOU want to admit such a bumble? Of course not.
I also realize that I have reached the brink of what I can publicly say regarding this issue. Why? Well let me share some observations from a personal experience:
Issues that do NOT want to be addressed by AW (and that are normally valid) will receive a courtesy "go away" type response. Anyone continuing to press the correction of that issue will receive warnings from AW privately via email... so as not to alert others in the Community Forum. Unheeded warnings will result in an "indefinite" expulsion of the individual from the Community. - These actions are no secret and are readily viewable in the Community Guidelines. Point is a manipulatory one. Cross the line seeking truth and you're liable to receive a gag order.
Therefore I will no longer pursue this thread - it is at the point of being locked by AW anyway I'm sure as it is also nearly reaching the point of being off-topic for the thread. (that happens when explanations as above are given - however it is all inherently ON-topic due to the reasons for no further reply or participation from AW regarding the still unanswered LAST set of my requests for assistance in this thread).
This is my last post regarding Meta Tags as I value my participation in the Community and wish not to be exiled.
I "do" agree that AuctionWatch has done an exceptional job and the price is absolutely on target. No doubt about that. The customer service personnel are exceptional also on everyday questions - their help and advice is invaluable and they are extremely friendly and professional as well.
I recognize a great service and a great value - but... since this is NOT a perfect world it is still okay to at least admit that there is room for improvement instead of blowing things off.
I won't waste anyone else's time with this... if it is meant to be corrected, I'm sure they will do so in short time.
Best Regards To All and I'll see you around the Community!
Greg Williams
Retro Bargains
www.retrobargains.com
I was wrong about Auctionwatch stores not being able to be listed in the search engines.
I just found out my Auctionwatch store has finnally been listed in in all of them except aol search.
My store is also almost always in the top of the first page of every search...
So..Yea,I guess I got impatient.I submited in the end of December and I was listed in the beginning of March.I dont think you really half to worry too much about being listed.
tomwiii is right..For 5$ a month Auctionwatch is doing a hell of a job!
[ edited by bigcitycollectables on Mar 10, 2003 10:12 AM ]
[ edited by bigcitycollectables on Mar 10, 2003 10:13 AM ]
