posted on December 9, 2001 10:21:14 AM new
Mybiddness, you posted while I was typing.
My dog started out growling at tall men, then men in general. My husband thought the same thing that your husband did - protective instinct - and didn't further train him. Then the dog started growling at tall women and women in general. Finally, he started barking at kids and we figured he wasn't safe around anyone without our being there. (We could leave him with my parents or my one sister who sounded just like me.)
posted on December 9, 2001 10:33:18 AM new
Do get your dog evaluated by the trainer. And when people come to your house, put her out in the back yard if possible, or into a room that you can close the door on until you start her on her training.
How socialized is she? Does she stay in your house and yard all the time, or do you take her out on long walks, to the park, etc.? Dogs that are not socialized in a big way can, no matter what the breed, be very aggressive toward unfamiliar things/people.
I have owned two very "aggressive" breeds over the years--Neapolitan Mastiffs and Chinese Shar-peis. I socialized the heck out of 'em. Took them out often, let everybodu & their brother pet them, got them used to people/crowds, other dogs, etc. Would walk both of the Neos at the same time *and* was able to control them.
My dogs were *very* protective of my house when I was not home. Knowing this, I kept my gates padlocked at all times to prevent someone walking into my yard. Still do, in fact although the three dogs I currently own (Great Dane, Greyhound, and Jack Russell Terrier) aren't aggressive whatsoever.
Far too many people never socialize their dogs and that can lead to trouble.
posted on December 9, 2001 11:01:16 AM new
Hi Saabsister That's what I'm afraid of - the escalation. We've had quite a debate about it between my husband and I this a.m.
Hi Bunnicula Haven't seen you in a while!
Ironically my husband said the same thing this a.m. He thinks that that's one of the main problems. In fact, he may start taking her to the search trainings just to let her be around other dogs but will keep her in the kennel so that she can't get to them. We have a nearby walking trail but I don't trust her out even on a leash and so she's either indoors or in the fenced back yard all of the time. We have a shephard that she used to be very aggressive toward. The shephard stays behind a dog run while Pheobe is taking a turn outdoors. She used to act aggressive toward Shadow (the shephard) but now just mostly ignores him. She's not aggressive toward our two cats or our smaller house dog.
posted on December 9, 2001 02:47:52 PM new
Mybiddness.. the suggestion that your husband believes that only men and dogs are at risk right now...is a serious problem...LoL
My little Rotweiller puppy could have killed a dog or a man.
posted on December 9, 2001 03:36:33 PM new
I have been reading this thread with some interest, as I put a dog down about 8 years ago. It was a German Shepard who was very strong, but who never attacked anyone, just scared them alot. We had this dog from the time he was a puppy until he was 6 years old. One day, my husband came in with my three year old, who had been playing on the swing in the backyard. The dog attacked him, with no provocation. The worst part was my husband had to physically kick the dog to get him off of my son. This was my husband's dog and even he was surprised that the dog wouldn't listen to him. When he brought my son inside, I told him to go outside, get the dog and take him to the vet to be put down. Luckily my son was not seriously hurt, but we came too close for me to try a second time.
My husband being an animal type person immediately went and bought a golden retriever (against my wishes, of course). I told him the only way I would allow this dog to stay was if he (my husband) was trained. We took her to puppy classes and they taught her alot of wonderful things - one was to get along with other dogs - another was to sit when they saw a child and several other peaceful training techniques. To this day, whenever she sees a small child, she hits the ground - I still chuckle at how well that worked.
The moral to this story is that dogs have to be worked with and trained, which I am sure you understand working with search and rescue. It sounds like your dog has had training of some sort to be able to react to your basic commands.
My feeling is tending to go toward the group - aggressive behavior is not a good sign. As much as I now love this golden retriever of ours, if she ever once had an aggressive side, I would immediately remove her.
I wish you luck, but I agree with the posters, don't ignore the signs.
posted on December 9, 2001 04:20:56 PM new
I agree with krs, put her down. Unfortunately, the aggresive behavior will only get worse. She may eventually turn on a member of the family. A dog bite is extremely painful. My little ten pound doxie bit me in the midst of a fight and it hurt like the dickens. True, dogs have a instinct to protect their family. The fact that she went after someone that wasn't even in her "territory" so to speak is a major cause for concern. I have seen many a pit bull that is very sweet by nature. Unfortunately, irresponsible breeding is causing major problems with the breed. The best dog to have with children are golden retrievers, not very good watch dogs. The joke is that sure they will watch, watch someone come in the house and steal everything.
posted on December 9, 2001 04:33:39 PM new
Good points... the problem is that I think she knows what I'm thinking - everytime I look at her today she gives me a sad look. She keeps putting her head on my lap and just staring at me and she's being so quiet and still today. I'll swear I think she knows. It may end up being the right thing to do but she's not going to make it easy.
posted on December 9, 2001 05:07:52 PM new
Oh, That is so sad. It's easy for someone not emotionally envolved to make a decision but in your case, it must be almost like killing one of your children...Hopefully, your husband is right.
posted on December 9, 2001 10:28:42 PM new
Doxdogy is on the mark about irresponsible breeding. Aggression is a trait that can appear in any breed and should be removed from the breeding cycle whenever it appears. Responsible breders do this as a matter of course but it takes many generations to show real benefit. Socializing puppies is an important part of incoporating dogs into human lives but it cannot overcome the aggressiveness which has been described as existing in this animal. The sense that the dog was out of touch with reality is more than a feeling, the dog very likely really was and had, however momentarily, reverted to it's more natural aggressive/defensive state. If it could talk it might well say " don't know what came over me" or the like.
That breed is very often bred to deliberately enhance the fighting aggressive traits. One separate and differently treated or trained example will not overcome that breeding. Though Pheobe may be seen as a victim with sympathy the danger that she presents is undeniable now that she has exhibited aggressive behavior.
You are taking a big chance by keeping that dog, no matter how pitiably she seems to present her remorsefulness.
