Spreland
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posted on February 12, 2001 08:13:48 PM
>>Now I understand. Put the crap that doesn't sell on the free sites."<<<
If you are selling "crap" you BETTER list it on the free sites, because Ebay's fees will destroy your profits. But I list ALL my items on the free sites because I don't need to pay eBay's fees to move my best sellers. I sell a lot of low end sportscards ($10 to $20) but I also sell PSA Graded ($100 to $300). 85 McGwires PSA8's are selling for $85 to $115 on eBay. Why would I pay eBay's fees when I can list it on a free site for $105 to $115 and sell it within 1 day to 2 weeks? Turnover? No I can not order these in quantity at a "wholesale" price. If I could I would sell them on eBay.
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sulyn1950
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posted on February 12, 2001 08:13:52 PM
>>"Trying to convince a seller who is doing well on eBay to go to another site is probably a waste of your breath""<<<<
As I already stated, [If my comments do not apply to you and/or you just don't want to read them, Click on "Spreland", Click on "Ignore".] What part of this statement do you not understand?
Perhaps you don't understand that you have already beaten this poor horse to death!
If you will permit me to make a suggestion? Why don't you pick one of your many titles on this subject and just bounce it back to the top when you have something to add?
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Spreland
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posted on February 12, 2001 08:31:58 PM
OK....I forgot to mention, there is that rare occurence where you list an item on eBay and the price just goes through the roof.
I had this happen twice during the two years I listed with eBay. The most notable was a "Yellow Submarine" video tape that I sold for $115. I won't lie, I would have listed that on a free site for $10. I didn't know it was out of print and was selling for this kind of money. I check completed auctions on a regular basis but I missed this one.
But weighing this rare occurence against selling items everyday at the high end of eBay prices and saving the fees, I will stick with the free sites.
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Spreland
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posted on February 12, 2001 10:26:25 PM
>>>"I've got 41 auctions running that end today and only 4 items have bids. Won't even pay the ebay fees from those sales."<<<<
Ouch!!!! Bad enough that eBay's fees mean that you are selling at a loss, but you have to pack and ship 4 items to pay eBay.
I had 10 items close on eBay with only 2 sales. I managed to make a small profit but that was the last time I listed with eBay. I started listing 10 to 20 items per day on Yahoo and was selling 1 item for every 10 that closed. When I reached 250+ listings I was selling 10 to 15 items at a good mark up with no fees.
After a few weeks you are listing 10 to 15 items for every 10 to 15 items that sell with 250 to 300 items always listed. In effect, you are reaching a 100% sellthru rate.
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Spreland
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posted on February 13, 2001 12:26:09 AM
300 items listed on a free site with a buy price of $10 each. Your average cost was $5$6 per item you would have $1500 to $1800 parked in inventory. If you sell 10 items per day at $10 each thats about 3% of 300 items listed.
If you listed 10 items per day on eBay at $10 each and everything sold (100% sellthru rate) it would cost you $8/day. Thats $2,800 per year paid to ebay out of your profits.
You can adjust the total items listed, your average cost per item, and your average selling cost, but this illustrates how just a 3% sell thru on a free site is more profitable than a 100% sell thru on eBay.
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traceyg
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posted on February 13, 2001 05:40:14 AM
What is minimum wage these days? last time I worked for the mini wage it was 4.35. Okay so I am telling my age a bit. I have a kid that works for me on the weekends on my web site and auctions I pay him 7.00 which he is happy with. Hopefully it is more then minimum wage . . .
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Spreland
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posted on February 13, 2001 06:22:57 AM
I think its about $5 or $6. I don't really know the exact amount, but $7/hr is more than a lot of eBay sellers are making. I think the masses of online sellers have been brainwashed into thinking that paying fees to liquidate items, is the only option they have left. If chain stores and shops tried liquidating all their inventory in 3 to 7 days they would all go out of business. Did this way of thinking start with eBay?
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twelvepole
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posted on February 13, 2001 07:14:14 AM
I think the masses of online sellers have been brainwashed ...
I wonder just what is trying to happen here?
Ain't Life Grand... 
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mrpotatoheadd
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posted on February 13, 2001 07:22:44 AM
Bidville is free- must post there... Bidville is free- must post there... Bidville is free- must post there... Bidville is free- must post there... Bidville is free- must post there... Bidville is free- must post there... Bidville is free- must post there... Bidville is free- must post there...
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twelvepole
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posted on February 13, 2001 07:25:26 AM
Why is that the MAJORITY of other online auctions have HIGHER opening bids for items that wouldn't even sell on eBay? If no fees it would seem that the seller could open for less and let the auction process take over. Or is that the seller needs more profit because the turnover rate is so horrible that they have sit on their items for weeks and months on end to finally get a sale. Then have more working capital and very very little profit.
I have two relatives that both work retail in Large store chains ( one computer and one clothes) and THEY do not sit on inventory for months on end.
In today's world NO business should be sitting on inventory for very long...turnover is the key.
Ain't Life Grand...
[ edited by twelvepole on Feb 13, 2001 07:26 AM ]
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Spreland
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posted on February 13, 2001 08:11:07 AM
>>I have two relatives that both work retail in Large store chains ( one computer and one clothes) and THEY do not sit on inventory for months on end.<<<
Thanks for the tip, but I'm not interested in working for a chain store or selling on eBay for minimum wage.
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unknown
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posted on February 13, 2001 11:12:16 AM
Well I think perhaps the real wholesale cost is much lower than you think.
Most of my buyers state that they are very happy with thier purchase and are astonished at the savings they get. My gross margins are ~70%. This means I buy it for $3 and sell it for $10.
I am constantly amazed how cheap I can really buy things at real wholesale. Those Chinese prisoners really work cheap.
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twelvepole
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posted on February 13, 2001 11:20:00 AM
Thanks for the tip, but I'm not interested in working for a chain store or selling on eBay for minimum wage.
They're not interested for working for Minimum wage either and Don't. 
They are interested in managing their stores to make the company profit. Which they do. And not by sitting on an item for weeks and months hoping it will sell.
Ain't Life Grand...
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Spreland
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posted on February 13, 2001 07:24:38 PM
>>Well I think perhaps the real wholesale cost is much lower than you think.
Most of my buyers state that they are very happy with thier purchase and are astonished at the savings they get. My gross margins are ~70%. This means I buy it for $3 and sell it for $10.<<<<
I was giving an example with numbers closer to the worst case scenario. Items sold for $10. Cost $5 to $6. Only 3% sellthru with 300 items listed. And you save $2,800/yr. in fees with only $1500 to $1800 in inventory.
If you were paying $3 on average per item you would save $2,800/yr in eBay fees with only $900 in inventory.
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Spreland
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posted on February 13, 2001 08:08:37 PM
My actual sellthru on Yahoo was closer to 6%
with around $3,000 inventory always listed. Saving over $7,000/yr in fees. Not bad numbers for mostly low end sportscards.
Looking at these examples, You can see why I shake my head in disbelief when sellers say "You cant sit on inventory..fast turnover on eBay is the key to success". I guess they would rather pay $7000/yr in eBay fees than have $3,000 to $4,000 parked in inventory.
(I ususally have 6,000+ parked in inventory with about a half of it listed on free sites. But I would rather have $6,000 parked in inventory than pay eBay $7,000/yr for "fast turnover".
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corrdogg
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posted on February 13, 2001 08:24:54 PM
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Spreland
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posted on February 13, 2001 08:30:49 PM
LOL...Looks like corrdog received his eBay trophy for busting his ass for minimum wage.
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surfsworth
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posted on February 13, 2001 09:16:18 PM
I believe the only thing that is really being said here is that you do not pay fees on free sites. More profit not for the majority of people.
For example using some previous figures
Lets say to keep this very simple you had $10.00 to invest in product it sold on both ebay and a free site for an average of $20.00.
Free site I believe someone said ealier they relist for several months until it sails to avoid fees so we'll go by that. every time the item sales the initial $10.00 is reinvested and put back for auction.
Ebay average 75% sale through (low by my results) and 10% seller fees (mine are about 7%)
free site average 1 sale per month
Gross sales are per year.
gross sales $240.00 Profit - $120.00 product cost = $120.00 net profit per year
Ebay average 3 sales per month.
gross sales = $720.00 - $72.00 10% fees = $648.00 - $360.00 product cost = $288.00 net profit per year
Lets say $6,000.00 in inventory is all $10.00 Items that is 600 items. If you repeat this with all 600 items you have made $100,800.00 more on ebay after fees than you have on the free sites in one years time!!!!
More profit on free sites, I think not.
Less fees on free sites, yes.
Looking at this I hope I have to pay $10,000.00 in Ebay fees this year.
[ edited by surfsworth on Feb 13, 2001 09:17 PM ]
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surfsworth
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posted on February 13, 2001 09:16:23 PM
Sorry I double dipped.
[ edited by surfsworth on Feb 13, 2001 09:18 PM ]
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twelvepole
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posted on February 13, 2001 09:16:46 PM
Hey there Spreland, you still haven't answered my qusetion of why the opening bids are higher, I guess my statements hit too close to home of being correct and now you're doing a little Fred Astaire side step... LOL
Ain't Life Grand...
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twelvepole
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posted on February 13, 2001 09:19:30 PM
Surfsworth EXCELLENT!
Ain't Life Grand...
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Spreland
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posted on February 13, 2001 09:24:45 PM
My mistake. Ebay's "Dead Horse" trophy is only awarded to sellers whose total profits are less than the total fees paid to eBay. Ebay discontinued the "Minimum Wage" trophy because they didn't have enough trophies for all the sellers making less than $5/hr.
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Spreland
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posted on February 13, 2001 10:25:13 PM
surfsworth, Using your example, I couldn't agree more. Ebay would be MUCH more profitable. But your example assumes an abundant supply of 600 different items with a 75% sellthru rate with a 100% mark up. This scenario is no where close to reality for the majority eBay sellers.
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surfsworth
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posted on February 13, 2001 10:32:18 PM
I also used higher than a 6% sellthrough on free sites that you described and used 100% markup on the free site items.
With a litle product reserch and and source searching the 100% average markup is possible. It just is a matter of hobby or business. If its a bussiness treat it like such attack it don't let up. Keep tweaking, keep trying new things.
"IF YOU CAN JUST CHANGE YOUR MIND, YOU WILL CHANGE YOUR LIFE"!!
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acescasino
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posted on February 13, 2001 11:01:51 PM
Here's my personal choice in a nutshell......I'd rather sell my wares at a mall that I KNOW will have a higher traffic area. Hey.........If eBay is the first thing that people think of when they're looking for merchandise of any kind, that's where I want to be. I don't have time to waste. Free sites? People will find me easier at a regular website. eBay ain't 'Big Brother.' He's dad, handing me the allowance money. Thanks, Dad!
And thanks for teaching me to show up with my hand out every Friday, and not waste my time on the other days.
AC
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Spreland
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posted on February 13, 2001 11:25:14 PM
>>With a litle product reserch and and source searching the 100% average markup is possible.<<<
When a seller finds an unlimited or abundant source for an item with a good mark up, I would be the first to recommend listing on eBay.
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kateartist
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posted on February 14, 2001 12:31:45 AM
I have an average of 90% of my auctions sell thru. I make a decent profit, since I make my own items.
I could put up a web page, but then I would have to maintain it, advertise it (which takes the most time and effort) and always be available to tend it.
Personally I don't think Ebay is a good place to sell common merchandise. Too much competition. If what you are selling goes over good, you can count on a dozen competitors springing up within a week.
Ebay's strength is in selling one of a kind items, such as vintage and collectables. Your advertising and findability are taken care of. If someone is looking for what you have, they can find you on Ebay. You can usually instantly find out what other people have paid (or not bothered to bid on) for similar items to what you have. Off Ebay, you can find other items for sale, but you will never find out how well they are selling.
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Spreland
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posted on February 14, 2001 01:47:21 AM
>>>Personally I don't think Ebay is a good place to sell common merchandise. Too much competition. If what you are selling goes over good, you can count on a dozen competitors springing up within a week.<<<
Generally speaking, if a seller is buying large quantities of items at a discount or "wholesale" eBay is obviously their best bet for high turnover.
But I believe the majority of sellers looking for good deals on small lots or individual new and used items are overly concerned with turnover and wasting money on eBay's fees. The obvious cases are paying fees to relist slow movers and paying fees to sell their better items faster than they can replace them.
In your case, I assume you can make enough items to keep up with the demand.
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Spreland
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posted on February 14, 2001 04:30:42 AM
>>>you still haven't answered my qusetion of why the opening bids are higher, I guess my statements hit too close to home of being correct and now you're doing a little Fred Astaire side step...<<<
I guess its kind of hard to respond to your borderline nonsense. The few comments you've made that come close to making any sense are irrelevant at best.
I check the completed auctions on eBay and list my items with a buy price in the same price range. What do higher opening bids have to do with anything in this thread?
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twelvepole
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posted on February 14, 2001 05:18:30 AM
Double post.
[ edited by twelvepole on Feb 14, 2001 05:21 AM ]
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