posted on May 23, 2001 01:10:32 PM new
I have no worries...
However eBay changes over time, I'll change along with them. It's no big deal, as I've been doing it for 3+ years.
The "big boys" may have some benefits to offer buyers on ebay, but they won't be customer service or response oriented in nature, so I'll be able to exploit their deficiencies in these areas to my benenfit. Guaranteed.
The long and short of it is that they will not be able to compete with me or you or anyone else who is willing to make the changes necessary to keep up and ahead of the times.
Take my website links away. Big deal. It won't make a bit of diffence to me. If a potential customer really wants to find me, they will.
Big boys are coming to play? Be my guest! It will take customers days to get a response. The types of buyers I attract wouldn't waste theri time with these guys, as they demand personal service.
Raise my fees? Big deal! The fees will go up for everyone and the increase in the price of selling with be incorprated into the cost of our products without notice to anyone. It will still be the cheapest marketing means in attracting a huge number of potential buyers by a longshot.
Offer storfronts? Great! Where do I sign up? I'm been looing for a new place to advertise and sell goods.
Any other menial change you want to throw at me? If so, try to think of better obstacles as these petty changes are even't worth the consideration of worrying about.
Is it me or is online selling still the easiest game in town?
posted on May 23, 2001 03:22:23 PM newComputerboy...I wholeheartedly agree with you!! All it takes to succeed at ebay is to roll with the punches and learn how to make lemonade!
In the antiques and collectibles the big boys are few and far between (if they even exist). Yes, Enesco, Hallmark, Goebel or their wholesalers could come on ebay but will they have much of the older stock that was retired a few years ago? Or has it already been liquidated? There is still plenty of opportunities for the dealers in these fields.
I agree the big guys are going to have a problem with giving good customer service. and although they may be able to undersell the smaller dealers for a while their overhead is almost sure to be higher...they have warehouses, employeees, etc that most of the small mom & pops don't. Eventually they will have to make money so their prices will raise and at that point the little guy can move back in.
We little guys are very flexible...we can just stop selling for a little while or quickly switch to something else while we wait out the big guys undercutting us.
As to your question "Is it me or is online selling still the easiest game in town?"...it could be you but I think it is more like online selling is the easiest game in town!
[ edited by amy on May 23, 2001 03:24 PM ]
posted on May 24, 2001 08:43:35 AM new
I knew there were other optomists out there among the long list of complainers! It's nice to hear from you.
Here's another point of interest concerning the "big boys" selling on ebay.
Most manufacturers of retail goods want to be an arm's length away from any transactions dealing with the liquidation of their products to the retail marketing channel. eBay, among others can be included in this discount retail marketing channel.
The manufacturers job is to protect their licensed distributors and retailers and marketing downline and they are not likley to try and "top sell" these customers by offering products on ebay. It would be construed as a direct conflict of interest by their customers. They'll let others do the dirty work and take the balme for the problems it causes, but to do it themselves wouldn't be kosher.
These manufacturers are willing to sell large overstock lots to liquidators. I'm one of them. If I purchase goods from the manufacturer and sell it on ebay or anywhere else in the retail market, the manufacturer can blame me for any problems it causes in the market. This attitude protects these guys who know very well what they are doing to their marketplace when they sell to me or anyone else at liquidation pricing. It's this arm's length that allows them to get away will these deals when they need to move product to make their numbers or turn slow moving inventory into cash.
The main point that I want to make with all this rumbling is that most of the liquidators out their that purchase these overstock lots are large operations. They rely on volume selling and often sell by the master carton, pallet or container load only. Most do not have the time, infrastructure of inclination to sell items one at a time on eBay. It's not how they operate. Sure, the small liquidation buyers like myself are going to be willing to sell on eBay. In fact, most already are, but the chances of larger players like overstock.com joining and being successful in the game is not likley. It has to be well worth their effort and the detail focus, individual shipping orders and customer service responsibility is not going to be kind or liked by them.
This mass liquidation online selling is not new. If you want to see how it's done, go to www.overstock.com, www.ubid.com, www.tradeout.com and take a look for yourself. If this selling approach is so grand, how come we're not hearing much about the companies that have been doing it for years? We only hear about ebay. Want to know why? It is beacause of US!
posted on May 24, 2001 11:21:08 AM new
Small time liquidation businesses of overstock or slow moving stock are fine by me.
But going back to my original premise that there is only so much room, what happens as more and more people get into the act and start competing for the liquidation stock?
posted on May 24, 2001 11:39:29 AM new
Anyone going the wholesale or liquidation, or overstock route is in for a rude awakening.
Using eBay, the wholesellers will cut out any middlemen. In the best case scenario if wholesellers don't opt to cut out the middlemen, you will find the categories awash with people selling the same items they bought from the same wholesellers, liquidators, and distressed stock.
I found many "wholesellers" on the internet, and quite a few of them now have links to their auctions on eBay, offering everything from computers new and used to jewelry.
There are only a few things that will not be under cut by competiton, antiques and handcrafts. But fees may drive them out.
posted on May 24, 2001 12:18:02 PM new
I'm wondering how many of you nay-sayers on this board have previous business experience?
I've been in business for myself for 15 years with several ongoing businesses and have come to expect competition as a part of the game. The fact is that if there is money to be made in something, there will be an unlimited number of people trying to capitalize on the opportunity. It's Business 101, folks...
If you try and stick around doing the same thing the same way you always have done it, I'll say goodbye to you now. If you're willing to be creative and can distiguish yourself as a leader among the masses, you'll prevail. Big or small, that's the way it works.
ebay is tring to make more money, something that you should also be trying to do. There expanding their revenue streams, just as you should do. They're finding new people to do business with, something you should also do...
posted on May 24, 2001 01:03:05 PM new
Hello ComputerBoy,
Precisely. Every eBay seller is in competition with every other eBay seller of similar items. Makes little difference if the matchup is a mom&pop versus another mom&pop or a mom&pop versus a megacorp.
In order to be successful you have to do something to make your otherwise identical item more valuable than the competition's.
It might be service. It might be price. It might be timing the auctions. It might be a novel approach in your listing description. Or excellence in your pictures and descriptions.
I've no sympathy for folks who complain about eBay fees, or the postal service, or the IRS, or regulations, or free sites and services going to a fee structure.
You want to sell duct tape or cheapo tools or last year's collectible and make money at it? It will take something more than simply slapping an auction on eBay or taking a table at a flea market. Somewhere in the equation you have to be creative.
posted on May 24, 2001 01:12:09 PM new
As others say they are doing borly , we seem to be increasing every year and i am happy that we are doing well. BUT i never count on this...the sky could fall in any time ??
posted on May 24, 2001 01:19:55 PM new
Also, on the bright side of things for those of us who want to stick it out no matter what:
1. Some sellers get discouraged after awhile with the work involved in selling online. They stop for awhile or quit altogether, which probably helps somewhat to keep competition on an even keel.
2. As more and more online buyers become savvy and protest by refusing to buy from sellers who don't provide the type of service and/or shipping pricing/options they want, well, this might lead to those sellers becoming discouraged at their lack of sales and See #1.
3. I think the customer's desires change over time. The savvy seller will try to take advantage of that and change to meet those desires. Those who insist on trying to sell the same thing over and over despite the lack of demand will eventually See #1.
4. Sellers who protest every little fee and refuse to accept the fact that sometimes it does take money to make money will fall by the wayside and further reduce any potential overcrowding.
5. Also, if you can sell items that people need on a continuing basis, like clothes and similar items, instead of just the latest fad, that can be a permanent stronghold for you.
posted on May 24, 2001 01:24:57 PM new
There are many, many sellers out there in the same market as I (small, inexpensive collector items - postcards, maps, automobilia, etc). The best hope is to get repeat customers who will check your listings each time they search. This requires some effort, but it's not rocket science. Try timely, happy, informative, PERSONALIZED emails at each stage of the transaction, a PERSONALIZED note included with the purchase, a follow-up email after the item has been delivered, and a contact email when you post a item similar to the one the buyer previously bought. It works. I'm not getting rich like jerry but I didn't expect to. I'm just trying to supplement a small pension and have some fun. So far it is working.
denisv ("mrvee" on eBay, but currently not listing because I am going on a vacation/buying trip - check my listings in late July!)
posted on May 24, 2001 03:09:19 PM new
Well Glory-be! A thread wth posts that recognize that competition follows success as night follows the day!
Posters who recognize that in order to succeed one has to work at it...no one (or no other business..ie. ebay) owes us a helping hand..we have to do it ourselves (AND we will have much more satisfaction when we say "I DID IT all by myself!)
Posters who recognize that Darwin's theory of natural selection-survival of the fittest also applies to business...he who adapts best survives...he who wants to continue to swim in the sea as other's are climbing onto land will never evolve to a higher level.
THANKS to all the positive, optomistic posts...you have brightened my day!
Only one thing...Code, I think there is "only so much room" if one refuses to adapt to the changing landscape...those who do see te changes and adapt will always find there is plenty of room on the next frontier (or maybe that is what you were saying al along!)
posted on May 24, 2001 03:25:36 PM new
Here here and bravo Amy.
This is a job and competition is inevitable,
those that recognize this and work their butts off will succeed just like in any other industry.Those that came looking for easy street will soon be left behind.
Like Jenndiggy Im also a female involved in the sportscard industry and have put up with intimidation attempts galore, some just straight out threats. I outworked them, outsold them, priced my goods at a reasonable
but not greedy profit and have pretty much kicked their asses at what they claimed was their game.(not all but the ones that targeted me) I now have a 80-90% sell rate and busineess is good enough that I even refer the odd customer to them if I can't fill a need.
I honestly believe that as far as Ebay goes
hard work and an ability to adapt are mandatory and are the surest and only ways to succeed. Getting caught up in all the distractions will only serve one person, the competition.
posted on May 24, 2001 03:48:14 PM new
I've heard all the "positive" smoke before when Amazon auctions was making "changes". In fact, some of the exact same things were said.
Amazon auctions is dead in the water and so are its sellers.
You can't teach a pig to sing or fly, no matter how "competitive" you think you are.
posted on May 24, 2001 03:58:06 PM new
Reamond...only problem with your analogy...Amazon was ALEADY dead in the water. In fact, if one looks back on it, Amazon was stillborn.
posted on May 24, 2001 05:32:54 PM new
The first 10 months of Amazon auctions I did 3 times the sales I was doing on eBay.
Amazon auctions was thriving until they made changes.
When the "nay sayers" chimed in on the Amazon board, we had the same chorus of sellers saying we must adapt, use different techniques, etc.. Well, 6 months later those same folks are now at eBay having left Amazon.
What eBay does need is a good competitive auction.
posted on May 24, 2001 06:48:40 PM new
I was selling more on Amazon than Ebay too.
I think when they saw how much sales us little guys were getting, it was hurting their own sales so they cut us off. No more tabs, etc.
I still do a fair amount on Amazon, but nothing like it used to be.
posted on May 24, 2001 08:24:15 PM new
Reamond...I don't deny some sellers were able to adapt to Amazon and made it work for them for a while...but in my opinion amazon was dead in the water from the start, it never would have been anything but a distant also ran.
Because Amazon never had the traffic or volume of ebay there is no way you can draw any corollary between them. What happened at Amazon may have been the final nail in their coffin, but there is such a huge difference between what Amazon was in size and traffic and what ebay is that any comparison would be flawed.
posted on May 25, 2001 12:34:57 PM new
Amy- at the time Amazon opened its auction site, it had more members than eBay. It had more traffic potential than eBay, and I sold 3x more on Amazon a month than on eBay.
Amazon had a thriving auction site until they made changes that in fact drove it into the ground.
posted on May 25, 2001 02:16:49 PM new
Reamond...the operable word is "potential". amazon AUCTIONS did not have that traffic, Amazon the bookseller did.
I don't doubt you sold on Amazon 3x the amount you did on ebay...although for that statistic to be used for comparison purpose to decide if Amazon was in fact a better site to sell than ebay at the time, we would need to know what you were selling on each site at the time, how much you were selling on each site at the time, the pricing of both, etc. Only then would we be able to do any comparison. Also, we would need to know how the other sellers were doing at the same time, with the same type of statistics for both sites.
Admittedly Amazon had the member figures to suggest they should have been able to give ebay a run for their money. The question is...WHY did they change their policies and in effect "drove the nail in the coffin"? Was it because the auction model wasn't working for them and they hoped by changing things they could make it viable?
If they changed the format/rules because the auctions weren't coming up to expectations then it doesn't matter that they killed the auctions with their changes because as far as they were concerned it was already dead or very close to it.
It is also possible that for a lot of the seller-user it was working but it wasn't meeting the goals/needs of Amazon. In that case it is only logical Amazon would try to meet THEIR goals and not the goals of the users, who wanted an alternative to ebay...or who wanted ebay to have competition so that ebay would have been forced to change its policies.
Again...just because Amazon "died" when they made changes, and just because some people were sayng the same things about amazon that some of us are saying about ebay ("as long as we adapt we will be all right" doesn't mean you can draw the conclusion that 1)Ebay will die also or 2) that adapting is futile. The dynamics may be very different (which IMO they are)
[ edited by amy on May 25, 2001 02:20 PM ]
posted on May 25, 2001 02:28:47 PM new
ebay may "die" in the long run just like Amazon. I don't know the future. But until I hear the death rattle, I'll do my best to keep on adapting to the ebay changes, finding ways to make my auctions more attractive (flexible payment options, keeping my shipping costs as low as possible), trying to offer excellent service along with doing my best to find new niche markets and finding new revenue sources ( or failing that, making my own).
I may not make it in the long run but I'm not going to roll over & play dead just because ebay evolved and I didn't.
As my late Mother always said, "USED TO is dead". What ebay "used to be" isn't here anymore but that doesn't mean there's still not money to be made if you are willing to work for it.
