posted on September 6, 2000 07:46:07 PM
Hello!
I have been reading the boards, and giving this alot of thought, and somehow I think I missed something here. This is again about Verified accounts and I will apologize in advance if my specific concerns have been answered and I missed it. I have a regular account and a Business Account with Paypal, the Business account being as you say *verified*. Muy concern is with my paypal account and the logo saying...UNVERIFIED making me feel like a dishonest Business Person, which I am not. It is like a stigma to be unverified, and the reason I do not verify with a bank account for my EBAY usage is for a couple of reasons the most important to me is What if I get a bidder that comes out of the sale and even after the item is delivered, uses it, breaks it, dirties it, or has buyers remorse and wants their money back? I should not be at their mercy for any of these things. If they truly have a problem with the product, we should be able to deal on an equal level, and the way I understand a verified account, is that they can request their money back using any reason they want to, and get it, leaving me holding the bag. Is this the way it works? Thanks. *S*
posted on September 6, 2000 07:58:43 PM
Hi furkidmom,
This is from PayPal's TOU:
"Purchases from Sellers who are Verified Users will be guaranteed against fraud up to $5,000 per Buyer per year if the Seller fails to deliver the paid-for goods. This policy does not apply to disputes about the quality or attributes of delivered goods. The Seller's verification status is available on the Service website when a Buyer confirms payment.
Although this Guarantee only protects purchases from Verified sellers, all sellers - both Verified and Unverified - should be aware that they are liable for non-shipment of goods. Non-shipment of goods may constitute a criminal violation, and X.com will cooperate with law enforcement agencies to apprehend and prosecute offenders."
It only applies to goods that the buyer never receives, not whether or not the buyer is happy with what they received. Hope this clarifies it.
posted on September 6, 2000 08:45:46 PM
Thanks jrscharton, and if that is the case then I have no qualms about becoming verified. It just makes me feel like a *leper* with that big UNVERIFIED that my customers see, a stigma, and since PayPal want this Verification, I am trying to figure out what is in it for them. Wouldn't you think it would be something, or why would they bother with it at all? I mean, to clarify this last statement...we, as buyers and sellers make our bsiness decisions, our TOS, our methods of doing business because it somehow affects the *bottom line*. PayPal should be no different, because they too are a business, correct? Just the same about public servents. They do not all have this overwhelming need to serve mankind. they are in it for some reason...money, prestige, (sp?) perks?
The verification process allows us to guarantee the transaction. The protective aspects of the program are better than being unverified.Being verified protects you against losing money on charge backs as long as you can provide adequate proof of shipping/delivery.
The issue here is the warning that tells the sender that the recipient is unverifed. The term unverified has a negative connotation to it. That word by itself is enough to make a potential user click the back button. After all, who would want to send money to someone who is unverified? IMO this is doubletalk on the part of PayPal. They say that it is entirely up to the user to decide whether to become verified or not. Then they turn around and use the unverified message to scare users away from the transaction.
If PayPal is going to use the term unverified, they should explain clearly and exactly what being verified or unverified means, and do it on the "Send Money" verification page.
By the way, I'm using PayPal again as you guys have made some changes for the better in the last few days. And as always, I LOVE the service and consider the 1.9% transaction fee to be a bargain. But there are still a few things that need to be done to the web site, such as the email address problem and the scary unverified message.
posted on September 7, 2000 05:03:11 PM
HI abingdoncomputers,
Thank you. I will pass along the concerns.
When sending money to an unverified user this is the following information that is displayed when clicking on MEMBER INFO:
What it means to be Verified: To become Verified, an X.com Member must provide us with proof that he or she has opened an account at a bank or other financial institution. Because these institutions are required by law to screen account holders, X.com's verification process increases security when you pay parties you do not know.
Buyer Protection Guarantee: If you pay a Verified seller, X.com will guarantee your purchase against fraud for up to $5,000 per year. Please use caution when paying an unverified seller you do not know or trust.
(asking the buyer to be sure when sending to an unverified party).
Thanks for the nice words. It can be tough at times, but I try not to take anything personally I am glad that you have started using the service again, as we have some new features coming out that will help all sellers (and be more secure).
posted on September 7, 2000 05:37:00 PM
I have a question for Damon. I was a verified paypal account, until the procedures were changed. I have not decided either way for this moment. But my account was set up for automatic insertions by paypal for their logo's on my auction and for notification. I am not getting notification. Is there a reason? If it is because I am no longer verified under the new system. LandOtters
posted on September 7, 2000 05:58:52 PM
Paypaldamon???? "If you pay a Verified seller, X.com will guarantee your purchase against fraud for up to $5,000 per year. Please use caution when paying an unverified seller you do not know or trust. This is exactly what I mean...the buzz words....fruad, caution, trust, unverified......Enough to scare the Bejesus out of anyone! Could you try to have something done about that wording? None of us know anyone realistically when we buy and sell. Alot of our business is done on *trust* and for Paypal to question that, being the integrity of the seller, rubs me the wrong way. Thanks!
posted on September 7, 2000 06:05:52 PM
Hi landotters,
Please check under your PROFILE to see if you still have your notification preferences set. The logos would not be verified unless you had verified your bank account and it would not impact your notification process.
posted on September 7, 2000 06:14:29 PM
furkidmom.
I share your concerns along with many other Ebay users. The sneaky
attacks behind the backs of sellers is simply unacceptable.
Now, they are moving in on ebay with very large logo's indicating
that the user is "verified" and at the same time inferring that
those sellers who do not float their advertising banners are not.
It will be interesting to see how far Ebay lets this idea float.
posted on September 7, 2000 08:34:10 PM
I no longer buy or sell to winning bidders that are not verified thru paypal, xcom or billpoint.
I've just completed buying from about half a dozen sellers on ebay and only one was verified. I sent emails to the others and the link from paypal about getting verified. Not of offend them I give them a story which could happen to them that as the winning bidder I could easily send them the money thru paypal, they send me the goods , and I than get my CC company to charge back to my account because I'd tell them I never got it and he/she as the seller would have no recourse thru paypal because they are not verified. I tell them of a couple sellers I know this happened to and one to the tune of over $600. from one person and they had it happen 5 times in one month and loss several hundred dollars more.
All of them have gone and got verified and they have told me they'd let me know when they got verified so I could send the money. No I went ahead and sent them the money anyway, just wanted to wake them up. Three of them were power sellers and didn't realize that they were not verified. They assumed that because they signed up that everything was o'kay and they had recourse thru paypal. Once I sent them the info they made there own choice to do so.
I also won't bid from sellers that refuse to get verified and I won't bid on anyone that just wants checks or money orders. Had a power seller in excess of 3000 feedback screw me a few months ago. He 's been receiving bad feedback for a while now and was still here a couple months ago don't know if they finally got rid of him or not.
Had a guy from Hawaii snap at me last week after I refused to send him a check because he wouldn't get paypal verified and threatened me with a negative. Big deal! I told him to do what he felt he should and I'd do what I felt I should and that was not sending him the money and I would inform eBay why. A couple days later heard from him saying he went and got verified and I could pay him thru it. Got my item within 3 days after I paid and he left me good feedback. I asked him why the change of heart and he stated he had received 5 other emails since mine wanting to pay him thru paypal but they wanted him verified. He was a power seller also.
Verification is for both the sellers and buyers protection. Everywheres asks for it now, eBay, Amazon, Yahoo, xcom, paypal and many other services.
It's stupid not to get verified or to do business with someone who isn't. It's not worth taking the risk.
Personally I spend to much money on the internet to be taken by anyone.
posted on September 7, 2000 10:14:27 PM
guyuellas> It's stupid not to get verified or to do business with someone who isn't. It's not worth taking the risk. No I do not think it is *stupid* at all. It is a matter of personal preference and I personally will not be bullied into anything unless I feel it is the right thing for me to do. You like apples, I like oranges...that make neither of us stupid, ok? Just a matter of preference. Sometimes you get a rotten apple and I get a sour orange...doesn't mean the whole orchard should be plowed under.
posted on September 7, 2000 10:15:25 PM
I am not what Paypal calls "verified" and I also do not intend to become verified. I personally think that its too risky. BUT I'm not concerned about it much. I had many transactions before this "verify" business came about, and have also done many since then (mostly buying hahaha)Without a single person caring about my verification. Its more like "hey great, got your money, sent yer stuff..SEEYA!" What I find interesting is that, there ARE lots of other people that are concerned enough to even stop using their paypal accounts because of lack of trust. You would think that Paypal would value their customers enough not to impliment something that clearly makes people uncomfortable. Especially since, afterall, it is the sellers and buyers who use paypal and therefore line their pockets..
posted on September 7, 2000 10:48:28 PM
Paypaldamon,
You stated in this thread, "Being verified protects you against losing money on charge backs as long as you can provide adequate proof of shipping/delivery."
Would it be safe to assume that a Postal reciept and a delivery conformation would suffice on this matter? If not, what type of infromation would be required to protect the seller from a dishonest buyer who says that he never got the item?
posted on September 7, 2000 10:54:05 PM
Hi yeager,
Delivery confirmation would suffice. A receipt is informative, but it does not provide the trackability that DC does on-line. In the event that the DC was not scanned, you still have a receipt of DC showing the address and date you shipped. This is far more secure for the seller. A receipt would not help to a large degree.
posted on September 7, 2000 11:01:52 PM
Thanks for your prompt answer. It's nice to have somebody "around the house" that can help us with these questions!
posted on September 8, 2000 07:23:04 AM
Guyuellas: DO you have information about actual charge backs that occurred? I keep asking and no one seems to have heard of any. You can email [email protected] if you prefer.
