lsst
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posted on October 21, 2000 09:26:28 PM
In your opinion, What does buyer pays actual shipping charges mean to you?
I have been selling for a little over a year. In my listing, I check the buyer pays actual shipping charge box. To me this means I charge the actual shipping cost- no handling fee.
I won an item in which the listing stated buyer pays actual shipping charge. I sell this type of item so I can estimate at the most what shipping and insurance will be.
I received an e-mail from the seller stating to send my address so she can calculate the shipping and HANDLING fee. There was no handling fee mentioned in the ad.
I have e-mailed the seller mentioning that the ad states buyer to pay actual shipping charge, not shipping and handling.
Did I miss something here? Lauren
[ edited by lsst on Oct 21, 2000 09:27 PM ]
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cybercat
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posted on October 21, 2000 09:38:34 PM
Nowdays quite a few sellers charge a handling fee and consider that a part of the actual cost of shipping. I don't like it either. I try to avoid those "buyer pays actual cost of shipping" auctions--or if it's something I really want--I email in advance of bidding to get it straight what the cost of shipping is. Trouble is--some sellers don't answer emails that ask questions about their auctions. 
cybercat
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nowwhat
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posted on October 21, 2000 09:46:23 PM
All I can say is be careful out there, be very careful. In the process of doing some research on a tie I wanted to list I happened upon an auction that said estimated shipping costs $10.00. They are charging $10.00 to ship a tie and if that isn't bad enough they are using the word estimated. Does that mean they could decide to charge even more if the tie doesn't sell for the price they want? Some of these sellers are scary!
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london4
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posted on October 21, 2000 09:49:47 PM
Until I started reading the threads here, my thought was the same as yours. I found out though, that there is a difference between "actual shipping" and "actual postage", at least in the minds of some. IMO, it's an attempt by some sellers to increase their profit margin. It's not a good idea to deliberately try to mislead buyers.
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Zazzie
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posted on October 21, 2000 09:58:53 PM
Postage=the amount of stamps on the package
Shipping=the amount of postage and the cost of packing materials
Shipping & Handling=the above and the cost of someone's time to package and ship
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belalug3
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posted on October 21, 2000 10:24:17 PM
I agree with most of what's been said on this post.
Personally, I add about .75 to my shipping costs. And yes, I suppose you could call this a "handling" fee.
But you know what? Many times I "lowball" myself on shipping--at times up to $2.
Since I think it's cheap and unprofessional to email the bidder and ask for more $$, I usually swallow these losses.
So the .75 "handling fee" sort of provides a cushion for me.
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ubiedaman
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posted on October 21, 2000 10:35:44 PM
I have been stung by these "hidden" fees in the past, and tend to stay away from auctions with no specific shipping amount. If it is for an item that I REALLY want, I e-mail the seller first to check it out....took 3 e-mails the last time to find out what the amount was!
Keith
I assume full responsibility for my actions, except
the ones that are someone else's fault.
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dman3
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posted on October 21, 2000 10:49:41 PM
Buyer pays actual shipping Charges mean just what it says buyer pays what it actually cost seller to ship so if I have to go out and I pay .95 for a box and $1.12 for bubble wrap papper shreaded or what ever else I use to pack tightly more then likely free postal costs say $4.85 Priority and .85 if you want insurance.
Actual shipping charges here is $7.77
ok and there is still no handleing charges here at all .
Handleing charges are not technically for what it cost to buy packageing but for admintration fees ok the cost of Recieveing the order (polite way of saying ebay insertion fee)
invoiceing charges (polite way of saying what I will charge you for my time to email notices or send postal billing Phone calls what not)
not to mention a small % of what it cost if I had help that did this packageing billing and so on cost of storage space you know handleing charges there is other items that some companys might also add this would be based on a percentage of your bid price just like Ebay charge seller FVF .
so Shipping and handleing in this case would look like this Actual shipping $7.77 handleing $2.00
so S/H for this sale is $9.77
Some people might say these things are all a part of doing business and for some department stores and gorcery stores it is. where the custumer comes to you its all added in to there retail price.
But For Auctions and mail order and other types of business where there is no set retail or garenteed sale price Other fee above must be set over and above your buyers best offer.
if you go to a grocery store and there are many of these today where you must bring your own bags or buy them and pack up your own purchases no bag boys and Items are not unboxed neatly on shelfs buy just stacked up opened and not individually priced The Item will sell for as much as 20% less then a full service store.
WWW.dman-n-company.com
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sword013
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posted on October 22, 2000 12:41:24 AM
lsst - "I received an e-mail from the seller stating to send my address so she can calculate the shipping and HANDLING fee. There was no handling fee mentioned in the ad.
I have e-mailed the seller mentioning that the ad states buyer to pay actual shipping charge, not shipping and handling.
Did I miss something here? "
No, you didn't miss anything, the seller is just unprofessional, in my opinion, and this type of thing will cost her sales. If she can't even pay attention to her own TOS, what kind of service can you expect from her?
nowwhat - I agree with you. Just another example of a seller that hasn't got a clue. Scary indeed.
london4 - "It's not a good idea to deliberately try to mislead buyers."
Umm, isn't it against Ebay's TOS to do this? Besides, when I see this from a seller that is offering something I am interested in, I just move on. It's just not worth the hassle to me.
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flynn
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posted on October 22, 2000 03:18:00 AM
When I list auctions I too mark the buyer pays actual shipping and that's exactly what they pay. Whatever UPS or USPS charges me. Sometimes I screw up and calculate wrong, but usually in their favor and not mine. Just Friday I had to eat $3.40 in postage because I wasn't sure how much it was really going to cost. Two light fragile items in huge boxes with plenty of protection, so I quoted $17.50 and it cost me $20.90. I would never dream of asking the buyer for more money!
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keziak
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posted on October 22, 2000 04:51:57 AM
I just mark the box that says something like "see auction description" since I don't know technically what people assume "actual shipping costs" means. In the description I give one price for Priority and one price for bookrate so my bidders will know their options up front.
Keziak
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victoria
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posted on October 22, 2000 08:14:13 AM
I always check the "buyer pays fixed rate". I give 2 fixed rates, one for bookrate which includes the cost of the box (.50 I scavenge packing materials) or the large envelope (.20 + .10 folder) and straight priority since the box is free. I don't have a scale, so I guesstimate how much it will be, based on my experience to date. Sometime a little high, sometimes a little low. I rebate when I guess way high, over a $1.00. I eat it when I guess low. I get exact cost from the P.O. if it's really heavy or out of US.
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lsst
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posted on October 22, 2000 09:05:14 AM
Good news- The seller e-mailed and said she did not know where I got the "handling" fee part.
I mentioned her e-mail stated it so hopefully in the future she will reword it. She does not charge a handling fee.
I learned a year ago from this board that it is best to state the shipping fee in the ad so there are no surprises.
I do not mind bidding on an item if a small handling fee is added. I just want the lister to state all "extras" in the listing.
For example, I bid and won a chair. The seller stated in the listing there would be a packing fee of $15 on top of shipping. I had no problem with this as she stated this in her listing.I knew the terms before I bid.
A chair is a big item and I understood it would take a very large box and lots of packing materials to properly package it. Lauren
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dman3
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posted on October 22, 2000 09:23:51 AM
I do Agree any charges and handleing fees should be stated in the listing or in the about me page even in mail order catalogs the Terms are stated on one page not not with every item.
I dont agree that buyer pays actual shipping means the buyer pay just what the PO charges. there is more cost to actual shipping then that.
what the Post office charges is just the mailing cost not shipping cost you really just want stamps put on your peices of china you just bought 
WWW.dman-n-company.com
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njrazd
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posted on October 22, 2000 09:23:58 AM
Although I do not state an exact amount for shipping in my auctions, my TOS states that "the buyer will pay exact postage charges, no handling fee or hidden costs. Insurance is mandatory on all items."
The only reason I do this is because many of my buyers will purchase more than one item and I always combine to save on shipping. And since most of my items are small enough to go first class in a padded envelope, my usual shipping charge, including insurance, is about $1.62. Compared to some jewelry sellers that charge $6.95 for shipping & handling (add insurance onto that), I think that is pretty darn good.
*************************
That's Flunky Gerbiltush to you!
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belalug3
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posted on October 22, 2000 12:22:21 PM
njrazd:
Just curious:
Do you think you might be losing some prospects by REQUIRING insurance on all your items?
Also, is it really cost effective for you to add insurance to EVERYTHING--even items under $10?
For me, adding insurance means a 15 minute r.t. drive to Post Office, 3 minutes to fill out the little green form, usually a 7 minute wait in line. Total time investment to add insurance: 25+ minutes.
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mballai
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posted on October 22, 2000 12:29:24 PM
I've said it before, but for those who haven't heard...you can't ship anything without handling it.
I use what might be referred to as a fixed or flat rate charge. It greatly simplifies everything, saves both time and money especially if they order a second item.
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magazine_guy
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posted on October 22, 2000 12:30:14 PM
agree with belalug- including insurance adds significantly to the time it takes me to ship. I doubt most buyers would appreciate paying for the extra time- so I avoid insuring all but the most valuable items.
I've lost I think 2 out of 2,000 + shipments, so this works out best for me. I essentialy self-insure (meaning I'll cover the loss, but I don't charge the buyer for insurance).
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dejavu
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posted on October 22, 2000 12:32:26 PM
belalug3~ A package never leaves us unless it is either insured or has delivery confirm. I keep bundles of delivery confirm stickers, insurance forms, and customs forms in my office. They are filled out before I get to the post office. My favorite postal clerk can process about 10 packages faster than a one package order where the paper work is not filled out & the customer doesn't know what he/she wants in the way of postal services.
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macandjan
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posted on October 22, 2000 12:33:28 PM
saying actual cost just invites all kinds of arguement from cheap picky people. I set a flate rate and there is nothing to need ironed out by a dozen e-mails back and forth no indignation that you didn't use the same padding and the postage was 10¢ cheaper so you are a slime ball. I will combine items when they are not odd sizes to make it cheaper but otherwise no negotiations. My time is worth more than a few cents postage. If it is worth a half hour of your life to argue over 50¢ postage go somewhere else!
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eoi
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posted on October 22, 2000 01:35:08 PM
If you are sending out stuff insured with the "Green Tag" you can save ALOT OF TIME by asking your post office for a:
"Firm Mailing Book for Accountable Mail - PS Form 3877". In stead of filing out a little green tag for ever piece, you just list the addresses on a page of the book, put the anount of insurance in the insurance column, and the clerk stamp the page to certify that everything listed was insured.
This works really well if you do alot of flat rate mailing or have your own meter, since an efficient clerk can just run a batch of $4.05 PVIs or just accept your metered packages, stamp the book and send you on your way.
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mrpotatoheadd
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posted on October 22, 2000 02:16:20 PM
If you are sending out stuff insured with the "Green Tag" you can save ALOT OF TIME...
if you switch over and use U-PIC for insurance. You can get $100 insurance through USPS for $0.40, and you don't have to go to the post office to have the package stamped- you can just drop them off in the mailbox.
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nobs
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posted on October 22, 2000 02:36:32 PM
Congrats to the sellers who charge only what it costs to ship and insurance if desired.
I am a seller who occasionally buys and that is what I do. I do NOT charge for boxes, bubble wrap, gas to get to post office, my time etc. because that is MY cost of doing business. I figure that into my opening bid and let the buyer decide the worth. I have a 98% plus completed sales where my items sell (and sell well) and only rarely does an item of mine not sell the first time out.
To the sellers that still find it necessary to add handling fees and fees for bubble wrap etc. - I wish you the best. Ebay is a competetive market and the cream will rise to the top and have good sales and the rest can just sit back and wonder WHY sales are down for them.
I will never charge a handling fee, a bubble wrap/box/packing fee and I will always cater to my buyers. They afford me a great deal. I can do business from my computer and make a very nice profit doing so.
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london4
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posted on October 22, 2000 02:40:06 PM
Be very careful of auctions that say "buyer pays actual shipping." IMO, "buyer pays a flat shipping fee of xxx" is better. That way the buyer knows that the fee will be more than the actual postage amount but at least knows what they're paying.
I once bid on an auction thinking actual shipping meant actual postage and not only did it mean the cost of materials + postage, the seller took the item to mailboxes etc., had them wrap and ship it and I ended up paying $8.00 for something that would have mailed priority for $3.20. The seller neglected to mention that she never wrapped herself, but simply ran a tab at mailboxes, etc. And this was a nonbreakable item!
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eoi
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posted on October 22, 2000 02:51:30 PM
Personally I would rather not make Ebay richer off my cost of doing business. I prefer to backload my cost of doing business into the S/H that so I don't have to let it become an additional profit center for Pierre and Meg. If I build it into the starting cost that means I'm giving more money to Ebay, which is not in my best interests, as Ebay will use it to buy up companies like half.com .
If I front-load my cost of doing business, about 20% of my items would start over the $10.00 mark which would mean that my cost of lsiting would be up 100%.
Generally when I buy on ebay, I find that most sellers are not nearly as greedy as much dot.com companies that often mark up shipping 100 to 1000%. I saw one company called gogglegear that was charging $15.00 to ship a mouse.
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abingdoncomputers
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posted on October 22, 2000 03:03:20 PM
I saw one company called gogglegear that was charging $15.00 to ship a mouse.
There is a seller on eBay who charges $12.50 to ship ONE 64 Meg SDRAM module. They weigh what, one ounce?
In all fairness though, if you buy more than one the shipping drops to $4.00 each for additional SDRAM modules (but you still pay $12.50 for the first one). And he DOES combine all into one package. Talk about making out like a bandit!
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eoi
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posted on October 22, 2000 03:14:00 PM
Well I had filed a false advertising compliant against that company, and was told by the DA's office that a company can charge what ever it likes for shipping as long it is disclosed.
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sword013
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posted on October 22, 2000 03:47:07 PM
lsst - "Good news- The seller e-mailed and said she did not know where I got the "handling" fee part.
I mentioned her e-mail stated it so hopefully in the future she will reword it. She does not charge a handling fee."
She doesn't know where you got it from? Like I said, clueless seller. It isn't good news when she can't admit that she sent you the wrong TOS in her email, and now wants to chalk it up to your inability to read? Not.
Sellers like this one give us all a black eye, IMHO.
Sword013(Joe)
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lsst
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posted on October 22, 2000 05:07:19 PM
I was expecting a huge handling fee (stated in the e-mail) and I truly was not in the mood to deal with it. (I had a death in the family and got the confirmation e-mail stating the handling fee 2 hours prior to the funeral)
To me it was good news that there was no handling fee because I now do not have to deal with a potential problem seller by arguing over the fee.
I agree the term should not be in her e-mail and I am surprised no one else has questioned it.
An earlier post reminded me of when about a year ago I won an auction for a Christmas ornament. The listing stated buyer pays actual shipping. I bid thinking it would be $5 at the most with shipping and insurance.
Well, it turned out to be $10 after Mailboxes packaged it for her! I assumed wrong on that one! I do tend to shy away from auctions that state we use an outside company to package. On the other hand, at least they state it in their listing! LOL! Lauren
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