posted on July 11, 2001 02:36:45 AM
I state in my listings NO PERSONAL CHECKS but I still receive them, all the time. I don't like taking them because it is too hard to collect on bad checks from out of state. When I do get them, I hold them for ten days, but this is no guarantee they won't bounce after I have shipped the item. If it is a large amount, then I call their bank and give them the acct. # and Check # and amount and have it verified it has cleared before I ship.
My question, is how does a person get these buyers to read the terms in your listing and abide by them?
If I return the check to them, it slows the process of me collecting my money and cost me a 34 cent stamp besides.
Why can't these idiots, understand NO means NO?
If they write for approval beforehand, then I do not have a problem with them sending one, if I approve it. It at least gives me the opportunity to check their feedback and make a decision based on that, but I will still hold ten days.
I just wish they would understand NO CHECKS means NO CHECKS! Does anyone out there return checks to them when they send one without approval? How do you others that don't accept checks deal with this issue?
Would appreciate any help I can get on this.
Thanks,
Kaysapphire
posted on July 11, 2001 02:53:48 AM
So you accept checks. How many do you get and how many times do you get burnt on them? I have found from past business experience that you will get burnt no matter how careful you are!
I don't want to get burnt, it kills the profits.
I am not in this for the fun of it - the profits is what keeps me from going hungry.
posted on July 11, 2001 03:01:47 AM
I think it depends what you sell? I've never been burnt with a bad check. I'm not in this for the fun of it either, and I find that many people simply won't bid on MO Only auctions.
posted on July 11, 2001 03:17:54 AM
So by your statement "most won't bid on MO auctions only" then I am assuming you receive alot of checks. Do you hold shipments?
I accept paypal and have 50% to 75% of the people who pay this way. Other local sellers here have told me they don't get that high of percentage of paypal payers but they do accept personal checks. So you may well have a good point and one I may have to ponder.
I never thought about it before, but paypal is costing me 2.2% plus 30 cents a transaction so it could increase my profits, if and only if more would pay by check instead of paypal. But I doubt that would happen since paypal gets them fast receipt of their purchases. A check will not do that, with a 10 day hold.
Paypal is another issue for me, I am seriously wanting to drop them cause of the fees going up on the 14th but fear a big loss of bidders if I do.
I sell a variety of items, most ranging under $100 and alot of them around the $20 to $25 price point. But what does that have to do with taking checks?
posted on July 11, 2001 03:46:37 AM
The good folks on these message boards recently convinced me to waver from my "no check" policy - I to was getting them anyway, just not very often. Since I have accepted personal checks, my sales have gone up and I have not gotten burnt once. Will I get burnt? Someday, I am sure I will - but for now I am enjoying the excess money coming in!
posted on July 11, 2001 03:58:27 AM
Maybe I should change my policy too. But you guys haven't addressed the issue of holding merchandise for 10 days. Do you do this?
I don't sell like items, I sell collectibles and antiques, so do you really think in my instance that accepting checks is going to get me more sales or higher ending prices if I do accept them?
I can see your viewpoints about more sales equal more profits. But I still am afraid of getting burnt. I can't believe you guys are saying you never have got burnt that blows my mind. I believe you but I figured you would get burnt alot on bouncy checks or insufficient funds.
Does a bad check via an internet sale, make it a federal issue?
posted on July 11, 2001 04:24:29 AM
I no longer hold checks -- and I make a point of that in my auction listings! Since checks can turn rubber as long as 30 days after deposit, holding seems a waste of time!
Out of approx. 600 checks over past 18mos, I've only had one bounce -- and he told me & made it good (including fees) quickly! I think, for the most part, at least in my category (books & MP), most people are very responsible & honest! I just went on vacation & shipped 8 items without receiving pmt because I didn't want to screw-up my fast-ship reputation...came back from vacation & all the pmts were in my mail!
If someone does bounce -- just give them 10 business days & then if they don't cough-up the moola, turn them over to www.madagency.com & let them ruin their credit!
posted on July 11, 2001 04:30:10 AM
I also sell antique and collectibles - or just any unique item I come across. I don't hold for checks, I have a friend that states in their auctions, that they will hold 10 days for checks if you have a feedback under 30.
I started to hold for checks, but with the inventory I have, holding this item and shipping this item - then having to check on a check to see if it cleared (they always did) just took up to much of my time. So now, I receive payment, it goes out my door.
I know someday I will probably get a bounces checked; hopefully it will be like tomwiii and quickly make good. But for now, it is really nice to see this stuff go out the door!
posted on July 11, 2001 04:35:51 AM
I have sold on ebay for 2 years. I sell antiques & collectables. I have received probably about 500 personal checks and so far have not had a bad one. I also don't hold up shipping not even one day. I suppose I will get a bad one some time, but since most of the stuff I sell brings about $20-$50 when I get a bad one I will just gripe and go on.
I currently am waiting for payment for a $700 item. In this case if it is a check I am going to wait about shipping untill I am positive the check has been paid and I have made this clear to my customer. I can't say about other categories, but for me checks for antiques and collectables are welcome!
posted on July 11, 2001 04:44:20 AM
tomwiii- I am so surprised by your luck with taking checks. What surprises me more, is that you state in your listings, checks ship immediately. That sounds like an open invitation for anyone that wants to write a bad check, they know they are going to get their merchandise anyway.
I find it amazing that your record of no bouncy checks is almost flawless. I am not doubting you but just saying I am totally amazed. I guess from being in retail business years back, I got more bad checks than I care to remember and these were from local people I knew. I live in a small rural community, where everyone knows everyone. So for strangers to not write bouncy checks astounds me. I don't mean to be overly skeptical but experience has taught me to be cautious.
I agree having packages lay around on hold is something I don't want to do for lack of room and like you said, keeping track of shipment dates would be time consuming.
I guess I could try accepting them and can always change back if I have troubles. Sounds like most of you agree accepting them helps sales. Does it help you get less Paypal by stating you ship right away on checks? In other words, does it help you save cc fees? I know you have no way of knowing for sure but you surely have an idea whether it does.
posted on July 11, 2001 04:49:50 AMKay: Like I said, I think it depends on your category! If I were selling video games or CD's, I would have to re-evaluate my check policy!
99% of my buyers are either comuters or elderly vision-impaired folks! Not a demographic group known for RUBBER!
BTW: I prefer online payment! Especially PayDirect or C2it! However, I've learned over the past 18mos (from all the SUPER posters here!) to follow this GOLDEN RULE:
posted on July 11, 2001 04:55:17 AM
I don't say anywhere that I ship immediately on checks, I just check the little box that says "accept personal checks" and in my TOS I say credit cards/bank withdraws can be handled through BillPoint or PayPal.
posted on July 11, 2001 04:56:40 AM
stan41...
Your reply along with the others imply to me that I am being overly skeptical. If that many of you are not getting bouncy checks then it must be far safer than I ever thought it would be. I know if I do accept them and get alot of them, then there is no way I can hold shipments. My spare room is out of room now with packages waiting for payment.
But I trust your opinions and none of you have said you hold shipments so must be safer than I imagined.
I thank you all for your input on this matter.
Still does anyone think it helps to lower the amount of cc purchases? I am getting tired of these constant rate increases (paypal), they are killing my profit margin.
posted on July 11, 2001 05:10:06 AM
tomwiii...
I would venture to guess that since my category is antiques and collectibles, that my buyers are more sound, reliable and safe buyers than CDS, Stereos, etc. As I don't attract that......... group of people. I couldn't find the words to insert, as I didn't want to categorize a group of people, as I know we are all equal, some just conduct themselves better than others. Obviously more payment options the better, but that I am not willing to do, at this time. I think keeping track of another cc provider would be that much more paperwork and time consuming. Which is time I could have spent listing and selling instead of doing paperwork.
MurphyBird:
Thanks for your input. I misunderstood that you listed that you ship asap in your listing on checks but now see that is not the case. Thanks for clarifying that. That would leave the option open to choose to hold it for ten days....good protection for some instances.
[ edited by KAYSAPPHIRE on Jul 11, 2001 05:13 AM ]
posted on July 11, 2001 05:39:30 AM
I've been selling books on Ebay for a year. I accepted checks, money orders & postage stamps from Day 1. My auctions state that I hold checks for new Ebayers. In fact, I never hold checks unless something seems weird, which so far has happened once (check was good). Keeping track of delayed shipments is way too much bookkeeping, and I ship next day almost always.
I've received 2 bad checks total, both were made good. And my safety net is that my bank only charges $3.00 for a bad check. Since my sales are usually less than $15, and I pay bottom dollar for my selling stock, this is an acceptable risk to me.
I do not accept Billpoint or Paypal. I am very happy with both my percentage of completed auctions and my sell through rate. My deadbeat bidder percentage is low.
I sell in the antiques category as well and get up to 30 checks a week,from a few dollars to a few thousand.
Over the years I have sold over half a mill on ebaY.In that time total checks cleared has amounted to about 200 dollars and about a third where never made good.
We do not wait for checks to clear even large ones as to bounce a large check in the thousands of dollars can be a srious criminal offense.
posted on July 11, 2001 06:19:35 AM
As many have said, the category in which you sell can make a difference w/regard to the possibilities of running into bunches of bad check writers.
My lone bad check came from a book buyer who never would make good on the check & the resulting bank fees. Out of the multitude of checks I've received, it was a minor blip in an overall good experience.
Unless you accept good old greenbacks only, every payment type is going to have good & bad aspects to them. From bounced checks to chargebacks to fraudulent cards to stopped money orders.
You need to evaluate YOUR customers and decide which payments you feel most comfortable accepting to minimize your loss factor (note I said "minimize", there's no way to absolutely eliminate it unless you take only cash).
And add me to the list of people who don't hold items waiting for the check to clear unless the item was over $100 and the buyer is not known to me. My one bounced check was for $11 and came back after several weeks.
posted on July 11, 2001 06:31:37 AM
I've always taken personal checks since I started selling on Ebay in October 1999. I've had 2 bounced checks. One just disappeared into thin air, but I was able to sell to runnerup bidder but did lose the check fee my bank charged me. The other was a bidder with over 300 feedback. She finally made good after about 2 weeks. I do reserve the right to hold checks for 10 business days after depositing before mailing item. Usually if they have high feedback or a repeat customer I go ahead and ship. Newbies, low check number or high amount of auction would make me hold the check. I did get one neutral from someone because she sent her payment late and didn't think I shipped fast enough, even though she should have read the auction terms. I do think not accepting checks does limit your auctions. I know I don't bid on things that don't take personal checks as this is the easiest method of payment for me.
posted on July 11, 2001 07:06:56 AM
ebay bidders do not read,there are so many individual sellers with varying terms and they figure they can bid now and deal with the terms later,plus they could get outbidded .
unless you have your website and host thousand of items ,then they will enter your shop and do some reading before they buy,in a flea market environment,dealers come and go,it is not worth their time to study each dealer mode of operation for just one item.
some do read,but many do not.
many banks charge stiff penalty for NSF checks,like 25-35 dollars ,so they have a lot to lose when they write a rubber check,if they do this often,they risk having their bank account closed.
if they are closing their bank account because they are moving out of town,they may write a check deliberately and claim they wait for all checks to clear before they close the account ,somehow your bank or you are just too slow!!!!!!
but this is rare.
Sorry, I got sidetracked for a few hours. I sell in the same area as you do, have never held checks, and have only had 1 bounce [buyer made good on it right away].
I've been selling on eBay since 97, and I'm also a power seller.[yawn] I've accepted numerous personal checks in the $250-750 range.
IF the buyer is a new user with low feedback, or had negs for non payment,and the $ amount is over $100, I WILL hold the check, which I DO state in my TOS.
I also do NOT accept PayPal, or Billpoint.
For those that REALLY need to use a CC for payment, I offer BidPay.
posted on July 11, 2001 07:19:17 AM
Just adding, I take personal checks, get a ton of them, and I ship ASAP. I've had, I don't know, maybe 2000 transactions so far and not one bounce. My only real problems have been with personal checks from other countries, so I ask international buyers to avoid that.
posted on July 11, 2001 07:54:16 AM
I have had two bounce out of hundreds accepted. After bounce #2 I went to no checks. I got a lot of comments from bidders so I went to 10 business days hold on checks.
In that time (9 months) I have had many more accepted and none bounce but several people complain about the long hold time. Also I have read the stories here about checks that bounce well past 10 days. So I am going to go back to a no-hold policy.
I think accepting checks can increase your sales. We have heard from many folks on this board who don't bid if the seller has no-checks or a long hold time.
[ edited by wbbell on Jul 11, 2001 08:10 AM ]
posted on July 11, 2001 07:55:51 AM
I've been selling online for 2.5 years now ...
At first, I held checks. But after reading a discussion on this board that explained how it can take up to 60 days for a bad check to come back to the seller (it has to do with the schedules that the banks are on to send their information to the other banks), I decided not to hold checks - Heck, I couldn't hold them for 60 days! and what good would less than that do me in terms of making sure a check wouldn't bounce?
Anyway, I've only had 3 checks bounce on me -- the first was for less than $5, and I let it go (I was naive and ignorant then ...), the 2nd made the check good plus fees, and the 3rd had to be collected by M.A.D. Agency ... it was wonderful! I got my money within a month, plus fees!
As tomwii says, I try to offer the best array of payment choices to my customers as I can.
El
"The customer may not always be right, but she is always the customer."
posted on July 11, 2001 08:14:33 AM
About 95% of my auctions are paid by personal check and I never had one bounce out of hundreds. I don't hold them either. Sometimes I wait for more checks to come in and deposit them all at once and I have already shipped the item. I figure that if a check is going to bounce it doesn't matter if it's today or tomorrow.
If it is only a small item in the $5.00 range, I tell my bidder not to waste money on a MO or cashier's check just send a personal check. They really appreciate it very much, and as I said, I never got burned.
posted on July 11, 2001 09:46:22 AM
I've NEVER had a bad check-knock on wood-and I always ship right away when I'm paid by check. I also prefer to pay by check, it's much simpler! Most of the time I do not bid on auctions that say NO checks.
One idea, just don't give feedback until the check clears. I always do it that way on the big items. Works for me!
posted on July 11, 2001 10:04:08 AM
I take checks, only had one bounce, but the buyer e-mailed me and said..I added wrong in my check register and think I wrote you a hot check, let me know and I'll send money order to cover check and charges...it bounced and she made good...The only time I've ever held goods was when I got a "temp" check from a new account. (it cleared)
I try to take people on faith, they have to trust I'm selling/sending quality books, and I have to trust their payment will be good. It seems to work for me.
posted on July 11, 2001 10:47:36 AM
I have not seen anyone say they DO NOT ACCEPT PERSONAL CHECKS. Everyone seems to say I accept checks and helps me get bidders and most that are bad have made it good. I trust all of your opinions and can see my policy is going to change immediately.
I will be changing all my listings to accept personal checks.Then use my judgement and only hold if low check #, negative feedbacks for non payment or newcomer with no or little feedback.[/b]
Alot of you says depend on what category you sell in, most items I sell are in the collectible categories. I don't sell new items. Average items I sell are in the $20 to $100 range.
I am still amazed noone has posted that had my policy of no checks, WOW, didn't know until now that I was in the minority. You all have helped me "see the light" that my policy is like living in the dark ages. Since you all agree, risks are reasonably low of getting burnt. I believe my fears of getting burnt have been diminshed and are no longer a concern to me. But instead I am now concerned that I have cost myself losing bids by not taking them.
Thank you to everyone who has posted replies to me on this topic, it has been very helpful.
posted on July 11, 2001 10:56:10 AM
I've been selling on-line since 1993, using newsgroups, and CompuServe back then - I've probably had over 5000 transactions, and especially before this past year, 95% of them were using personal checks.
Over that time, I've had maybe 4 checks bounce. I very quickly was paid by the customers, and of course they paid the extra fees my bank charges (Which luckily is only $5) - With that ratio, I rarely hold checks. If the sale is over $100, I will hold for a week, but anything under $100 gets processed like cash. I think my customers like this, as my feedback usually mentions fast shipping (and if buyers look, I think that would be another factor to bid)
