posted on October 28, 2008 08:24:12 AM
Well... it was bound to happen with the new Feedback policies... I got my first retaliatory negative feedbacks (2 from the same jerk) for filing unpaid item strikes against him. Guy gave me a sob story about already sending payment... his exact words were:
"you a money order. I assume you did not receive it. I will not be making another one as it is not worth the cost"
Heck... what other option did I have than to close the dispute to request the final value fees. It's the only recourse eBay gives sellers any more! And... not completely sure I believe him anyway...
Anyhow... really doesn't affect me anyway... I'm done selling on eBay. My last listings were over a week ago. Just trying to finish up with the last non-paying stragglers.
I feel sorry for the rest of you that are stuck with these unfair policies though! (and the new design on the Resolution Center is HORRIBLE!... can't easily sort anything to find disputes!)
******************************
posted on October 28, 2008 08:37:33 AMHeck... what other option did I have than to close the dispute to request the final value fees. It's the only recourse eBay gives sellers any more!
No, you could have simply not opened the dispute in the first place. Many sellers have given up trying to get their fees back since the hit to their bottom line from all ones is potentially way more than the lost fee.
Sellers who are also buyers have been playing this as well. This is a great time to buy on eBay -- and if you decide not to pay, no harm, no foul.
posted on October 28, 2008 07:39:09 PM
Losing Feedback privileges
In certain circumstances, members can lose Feedback privileges. For example, a seller might file a Resolution Center case with a buyer who doesn’t pay for an item. If the buyer doesn’t respond to the case before the deadline and receives an unpaid item strike, any negative or neutral Feedback left by that buyer is removed.
As a buyer, always respond quickly to cases opened by sellers. If you resolve the situation with the seller (for example, by making a payment by phone or email), send that message through the case in the Resolution Center. Otherwise, you might lose your Feedback privileges for that transaction. For more on responding to cases, see "Responding to a case against you" in Resolving transaction problems in the Resolution Center.
Note: If the buyer is no longer a registered user of eBay when the seller opens a case for an unpaid item, the buyer’s negative or neutral Feedback is removed immediately.
Situations in which Feedback might be removed
We might remove Feedback ratings or comments in these cases:
*
The rating or comment violates the Feedback Abuse policy.
*
A member couldn’t be contacted at the time of the transaction.
*
A member left negative or neutral Feedback intended for another member, informed us of the error, and has already placed the same Feedback for the correct member.
*
A member was under 18, and therefore unable to form a legally binding contract, when the bidding ended or when Feedback was left.
*
If we suspend a member, we’ll remove all their negative and neutral Feedback from the site. If a member is suspended within 90 days of registration, we’ll remove all their Feedback.
*
We receive a valid court order requesting Feedback Removal.
*
A buyer fails to respond to the Unpaid Item process.
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When communication or comments left by the buyer within the Unpaid Item Dispute Console undermine the integrity of the Unpaid Item process and the eBay Feedback system.
toni
[ edited by tonimar1 on Oct 28, 2008 07:51 PM ]
I honestly believe that's eBay's intent... it certainly isn't in their best interest to encourage sellers to request fees back when transactions go sour.
If I wasn't already done with eBay... I probably wouldn't have even filed... since as you said, it ultimately hurts the bottom line more than the amount refunded in fees... but I am 100% finished with eBay. (and doing a happy dance).
And.. as for getting the negs removed... I already contacted Powerseller support (I know... I shouldn't have wasted my time... just didn't want to go out with red marks... professional pride, ya know!). They did respond promptly but said... as long as the buyer responds to an unpaid item dispute (even if all they say is I'm not sending payment) then eBay won't remove the feedback. Real nice... huh?
Like Fluffy said... great time to be a bidder on eBay...
As for selling... well... I'm not gonna let the door hit me on the way out... I love being my own boss on my own website... and my profits are way up!!
posted on October 30, 2008 05:56:19 AM
Just had ANOTHER non-paying bidder leave a negative because I filed an Unpaid Item Dispute... (of course, this one never responded to any emails, or even the unpaid item dispute...) Hopefully he won't make any response in the unpaid item dispute over the next few days and this one will disappear when I file for my fees.
It's real interesting... I've been doing business on eBay since 1996. I've always dealt with non-paying customers the same way... and it's only now with the feedback changes that THEY are totally abusing the system.
If I was still selling on eBay.. I'm sure after this past week, I'd stop filing unpaid item disputes. That's probably exactly what eBay intends... because then they don't have to refund fees. Good thing I AM done... and I'm not gonna let a single bidder off the hook. Either pay me or get an unpaid item strike. That's the way it should be, anyway!
******************************
posted on November 1, 2008 02:46:29 AM
Just found this on the PS board. I have not had any experience with getting negged by a NPB (yet!) but the suggestion below may help.
" if the buyer has not paid you at all, you should write to [email protected] and ask for his help getting the negative removed.
Negs from nonpaying buyers is a violation of the Enhanced protection for Unpaid Item under the Buyer accountability policy. [url]http://pages.ebay.com/services/forum/new.html[url]
You can try appealing it through T&S first, but they often botch the appeal so Griff usually will help."
posted on November 1, 2008 02:50:54 AM
PS, I still file NPBs and will continue to do so. Had to file one last week. I am in a totally DGAD mood when it comes to feedback or DSRs anymore whne it comes to bad buyers.
posted on November 1, 2008 07:01:30 AM
I'm filing NPBs whenever they are appropriate. To h*ll with stars, lowered searches, no discount, etc. The deck is stacked against sellers with no recourse for buyers who leave unreasonable DSRs so you might as well get you pennies back on non-payers.
Since Ebay does not care about sellers, perhaps they will take notice if everyone files for their piece of the pie back when sales go south.
posted on November 1, 2008 09:38:58 AM
sad part is ...eBay still WINS...
You get back your FVF but your listing fees are deposited into eBay's "scroo-u" fund....
Gotta love the new system...create a bunch of fictious NON-PAYING buyers(several thousand or so)...let the sellers go through the jumps and hoops to file for the FVFs and eBay keeps the listing fees. Oh and let these "buyers" mess with the DSRs, you as a seller will never know where they came from.
as Merrie says...."To h*ll with stars, lowered searches, no discount, etc"...you did notice they RETRACTED the "CANNOT LIST IF BELOW 4.3"....they knew they would get their butt kicked for that one.
posted on November 1, 2008 09:46:05 AM
Another small contribution I am making to the "hit 'em where it hurts" (bottomline) is to withdraw all monies from my PayPal account every day, no matter how small. They are not getting the float on my meager deposits. You can withdraw anything over $1.00.
I especially will not PAY another seller from my PayPal balances. I withdraw and then pay via CC. They hate that, they try to hide the ability to do it. You have to search for alternative payment options. Scr*w them if they are going to get my Paypal % fees and then use the same money to get the fees from another seller. Let them pay the CC fees.
posted on November 1, 2008 01:37:40 PM
rhpepsi - so the aren't going to stop seller from listing with less than 4.3? I have a friend that will be happy to hear that.
It hard to keep track of the changes ebay has made but it harder to keep track of the changes they said they made and then didn't make!!!
What happens to no live auctions?
What happens to not editing to extend or shorten the number of days of a listing?
EBay has lowered the minimum DSR rating to 4.1 (rather than 4.3). However, they have also stated that if you are below 4.3 then your listings will have worse placement in search.
posted on November 1, 2008 03:37:01 PM
ladyjewels...officially on their announcement board a couple weeks ago;
Seller Standards: new policy requires minimum DSRs to list on eBay
I also want to remind you that the new Seller Standards policy is going into effect on November 3. We will begin enforcement of this policy as follows: Sellers with one or more Detailed Seller Rating (DSR) below 4.1 will be restricted from listing. Sellers with a DSR between 4.1 and 4.3 will be allowed to list, but their listings may be subject to further demotion in search results. ......
for further details and questions...this answers a lot;
New seller standards: minimum 4.3 on all DSRs
What are the minimum DSR requirements to list on eBay?
Starting November 3, 2008, sellers will be expected to have a minimum of 4.3 over the past 30 days in all four detailed seller ratings (DSRs): item as described, communication, shipping time, and shipping and handling charges. Sellers with less than 10 DSRs over the past 30 days will be evaluated on their DSRs over the last 12 months.
Is this new Seller Standards policy likely to impact a large number of sellers?
No. The vast majority of sellers on eBay, about 96%, have DSRs at or above 4.3. The main purpose of this new policy is to protect the interests and reputation of that large majority from the impact of the few sellers whose customer satisfaction levels are below a reasonable standard.
What happens to sellers who do not meet the DSR requirements by November 3, 2008?
Sellers with a DSR below 4.1 will be blocked from listing on eBay.com. Sellers with a DSR below 4.3 but higher than 4.1 may have their listings further demoted in search results.
What does it mean to be "blocked" from selling? Is this the same as suspension? How long will a seller be blocked?
Sellers will not be allowed to list, but will not be suspended. Sellers will continue to be blocked from listing as long as their DSRs are not at least 4.1. Blocked sellers may list items again once their DSRs meet or exceed the threshold. Blocked sellers can accomplish this in the following ways:
Complete current transactions successfully and receive high DSRs
If 12-month DSRs are above the minimum standard, wait for low DSRs over the last 30 days to roll off until the 30-day DSRs are above the threshold or a full 30-days have passed
If 12-month DSRs are below the threshold, wait until low DSRs to roll off
Will existing listings of sellers falling below 4.1 DSRs be removed from the site?
No, existing listings will not be removed but sellers will be blocked from new listings and from relisting, and Good 'til Cancelled listings will not renew. Blocked sellers are encouraged to complete existing listings and earn high DSR scores to meet the minimum standards and regain listing privileges.
What happens to sellers who meet the thresholds by November 3, 2008, but fall below the threshold in the future? Will they have an opportunity to improve or appeal?
Sellers may immediately be blocked from listing if they fall below the threshold after November 3rd, 2008. Sellers will not be given warnings and opportunities to improve, but there will be an appeals process.
How are DSRs evaluated? Are DSRs rounded?
DSRs are based on the last 30 days of activity; sellers with less than 10 DSRs in 30 days will be evaluated on the last 12 months. DSRs are rounded, therefore a Shipping Time DSR of 4.05 will round up to 4.1, whereas a DSR of 4.04 will round down to 4.0.
What about new sellers or people who sell only occasionally with no DSRs?
Sellers with less than 10 DSRs in the last 12 months will be allowed to sell and will be evaluated using 12-month DSRs once they have 10 or more.
Will sellers from other countries be held to the Seller Standards?
Sellers from other countries listing directly on eBay.com, eBay Motors Parts & Accessories, and Half.com will be held to the standard.
Do my DSRs from outside the US count toward these requirement limits?
All DSRs are included in the computation of your scores. While international shipping and handling scores are on average lower than domestic, they impact typical US sellers by less than 0.02 points.
I BELIEVE THERE IS STILL A MAJOR PROBLEM WITH THIS SYSTEM. I HAVE RECEIVED A FAIR AMOUNT OF FEEDBACK IN THE PAST FEW WEEKS. MY YEAR TOTALS HAVE SEEN A SLIGHT VARIATION, BUT THE "DISCOUNT 30-DAY DSRs" HAVEN'T MOVED! WHICH EVEN IF IT WAS "BACK-END" DSRs...IT HONESTLY LOOKS LIKE STRAIGHT MANIPULATION FROM EBAYS PART.
added;
THEVIDEOBARN -- ranked #61 / 100 --- 12 month DSR is posted at 4.2 (so 30-day probably much lower)...curious if they list anything on Tuesday.
MOVIEMAGICUSA -- ranked #50 /100 --- MUST BE PLAYING the videos for EACH BUYER -- has a 5 (FIVE) on description DSR.
anyone want to buy a piece of land in Alaska???
[ edited by rhpepsi on Nov 1, 2008 03:56 PM ]
posted on November 1, 2008 06:59:59 PM
The whole "system" is bull!! Most sellers ***s fall on the shipping and handling ***s. If a 4 is considered "REASONABLE"!! why should we/they/us be penalized if we have 4s???
posted on November 3, 2008 09:41:23 AM
Back to the matter at hand - I have had 3 negatives from NPB and each time attempted to have them removed. You have to prove that they are in direct relation to the person not paying. I know, it makes no sense.
I lost all three - now I don't bother if the item sold for under $50.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Caroline
posted on November 3, 2008 01:12:35 PM
I just reviewed the last 40 unpaid item disputes we had that were closed and almost every one of them the buyer has zero feedback and all except one are still members.
In my opinion, Ebay is going to end up with a bunch of buyers (that don't pay), but no sellers.
Reasons like this are why Ebay went from 90% of our business to about 12%.
posted on November 3, 2008 07:50:24 PM
It's still not too late to go short Ebay stock.
Seems to me the best possible outcome here is a takeover of Ebay by Google or Microsoft, and that would be at a 40% discount to today's price, at best. And that's only because of Paypal's value.
$10 per share...10 cents a pail.
The sooner the better for a takeover I think....... for sellers.
posted on November 4, 2008 12:54:12 PM
How on earth is a seller expected to raise DSRs if he/she is suspended and can't list? Does that make sense to anyone?
posted on November 4, 2008 06:50:16 PM
Blueyes, you cannot raise your DSRs when you have been blocked from listing. Ebay is giving you a 30 day vacation. The 30 day DSRs eventually roll-off on their own and you begin again.
posted on November 4, 2008 07:29:59 PM
It seems to me that the eBay policy is that "buyers are always right". I wrote in an earlier thread about a buyer who had an incomplete mailing address. She complained that the package had not arrived, so I said I would replace it, but checked the address first and she told me I had it wrong. There was NO WAY I could convince her that it was wrong on eBay and Paypal. I called eBay and they sent her an email telling her it was incomplete, and she would not believe them either. She said in 8 years she had never had a problem with the street name not being there. Well, she filed with Paypal for return of her fees, and right on the claim form was the incomplete address, she would STILL not accept it. I called Paypal, and they agreed it was wrong, but because I had no mailing confirmation, they said they could do nothing.
Well, the package arrived, so she closed the claim. I sent her a nice message saying I was happy it had arrived, and she promptly left me neutral feedback saying it took over a month to arrive, and slammed all my ratings. I wrote to eBay, but they said there was nothing they could do because she had now updated her email address! Surely that means she now knew she had it wrong. They told me to file and ask her to remove the neutral, which I did, and as I expected, she declined, saying the feedback she gave was accurate. I was very upset, I told eBay that I feel sellers are so vulnerable now, with absolutely no recourse. She was completely wrong, but received no penalty. I on the other hand got all my ratings lowered and I did nothing wrong. The system is SO unfair.
posted on November 5, 2008 08:27:16 AM
Well... I was able to file the unpaid item strike against the second one that left me a negative... and since he didn't respond to the dispute... that one disappeared. I've just about finished up filing my unpaid item disputes. I've got almost 40 open cases! I wonder how many more negs I'll end up getting...
I'm so glad to be DONE with eBay! It's not worth the effort, especially when bidders have no incentive to follow through with their bid.
******************************
posted on November 5, 2008 09:36:40 AM
Next month, I will have been selling on eBay for 10 years. In the last 6 weeks I have had 3 Paypal chargebacks, only one in the years before, 6 non-payers, many late payers, and rudeness I never encountered before.
According to eBay, the feedback changes were to protect buyers from getting retaliatory feedback. What about all the ones sellers are getting when we file NPB. I guess the buyers used to complain, it's time sellers did the same. Every time I have got neutral feedback recently, I have called or written to eBay. If they listened to buyers, why not to sellers? It's worth a try.
Caroline