kraftdinner
|
posted on March 19, 2005 12:24:54 PM new
What should be done with these men? I haven't heard of any of them being rehabilitated, so what about castration after their first offense (which usually isn't killing right off the bat)? Why does society frown upon that so much?
|
classicrock000
|
posted on March 19, 2005 12:53:30 PM new
"so what about castration after their first offense"
after their first offense?? If they're child killers,there shouldnt be any "after their first offense",they should be executed the first time.Are you talking about child molesters??
|
parklane64
|
posted on March 19, 2005 12:57:08 PM new
I vote for medical experimentation and organ donation.
|
Libra63
|
posted on March 19, 2005 01:11:56 PM new
I don't know what can be done. But the man that just confessed to the kidnap and murder in florida was a previous sex offender and lived only two blocks from her.
Maybe they need to build a prison, well lets call it a House surrounded by a fence that has electricity running through it or maybe a farm out in the middle of no where. When they are released from prison send them there and then they know they won't hurt anyone else. I understand these citizens that live in a community where the state is trying to locate a home for sex offenders and they try and put them in a neighbor hood with children. I could never understand that. Well I think putting them all together in one place is about the best thing they can do for both parties.
_________________
|
kraftdinner
|
posted on March 19, 2005 01:12:37 PM new
Classic, I thought usually these men start out with molesting and rape, then graduate to killing. (??) I just don't think a molester should be given a second chance to do it again or to take it further. I'd like to learn more but it's difficult to read about these people without getting angry. It seems to me that we forsake children so these men don't have to lose their "rights".
Parklane, how would you do that?
|
Linda_K
|
posted on March 19, 2005 01:20:53 PM new
They should be locked up and the key thrown away.
This last little girl that was murdered, the TV commentator said lived in an area with 50, that's right fifty released child molesters living right around her. With those odds what chance does a child have. 
|
fenix03
|
posted on March 19, 2005 01:38:23 PM new
I think there are two seperate issues at hand.
If you are talking about someone that kidnaps rapes and kills a child - that's incredibly simple... Death Penalty.
If you are talking about child molestation I don't think there can be a single cut and dry rule. First there needs to be absolute seperation between "child molestation" and "sex with a minor". One is forced, one is consentual. As far as the forced goes...First singular offense, 10 years, no early parole with therapy and involvement in programs where former molestation victims talk about the long term effects of the crime. Second offense or serial offender...Life, no possibility of parole (personally I like death penalty in that case as well but there's no hope of that one).
Park - I like the organ donation aspect...maybe we should start re-implementing firing squads. One clear shot to the head then immediately turn the body over for organ extraction.
~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~
If it's really "common" sense, why do so few people actually have it?
|
crowfarm
|
posted on March 19, 2005 01:49:02 PM new
Sorry, Kraft, but castration will NOT stop child molesters or rapists or murderers. These are basically acts of violence and I think only drugs can temper that.
|
kraftdinner
|
posted on March 19, 2005 01:56:41 PM new
Crowfarm, then how come women don't commit these kinds of crimes? Isn't it all testosterone related?
|
classicrock000
|
posted on March 19, 2005 02:09:18 PM new
"These are basically acts of violence and I think only drugs can temper that."
yea like an overdose of sodium pentathal
|
Linda_K
|
posted on March 19, 2005 02:21:45 PM new
On the 'drugging them' aspect...it just doesn't work. Sure they're ordered to take them...but there's very little, if any, reinforcement to 'make' them do so.
Just like other mental patients...go though the expense of councelling and providing drugs...but then they don't take them and nothing is done about it.
And KD, imo the reason we're seeing what I believe are more deaths of the children that have been molested/raped is because the molesters don't want them to be able to identity them to the police.
|
kraftdinner
|
posted on March 19, 2005 03:35:33 PM new
But Linda, what can a parent do even if they know a sex offender lives near them or next door? Move? Then you get into what Fenix talked about where the sex offender lists include sex with minors and not all are potential hazards.
I'd really like to hear from those that oppose the death penalty like I do. When it comes to children, I can't think of another solution.
|
Linda_K
|
posted on March 19, 2005 03:49:32 PM new
KD - Since you do oppose the death penalty....is it different to you when children are involved? Like why wouldn't just locking them up for life be satisfactory to you...rather than giving them the death penalty?
On moving....are you kidding. IN A FLASH if I found a large number living in my area...like was found in this area. Heck we moved once because we thought the grafattie on walls at the local mall was getting to be too much. Shows undesirables are moving in.
I think these website where a lot of people can check out the molesters BEFORE they buy/rent in that area. And yes, I would avoid high risk areas. We're talking about the safety of my children/grandchildren there.
One problem is when so many child molesters leave one area and move to another....they themself don't always register their new living quarters as required by law. Then you have no idea.
We as a society have to get more harsh on the ones that are found guilty...and not keep playing this revolving door game with them.
|
Bear1949
|
posted on March 19, 2005 04:11:23 PM new
Only one sure solution, .45 between the eyes.
A word to the wise ain't necessary, it's the stupid ones that need the advice."
- Bill Cosby
|
cherishedclutter
|
posted on March 19, 2005 04:38:05 PM new
Since KD asked for opinions from those who oppose the death penalty, here's mine.
From what I've read and heard, pedophiles have not been successfully rehabilitated - so I think that life imprisonment without the possibility of parole is an appropriate punishment on the first offense, whether or not the child was killed. But that's probably never going to happen.
The only thing castration would do is make an angry disturbed man, angrier and more disturbed.
|
yellowstone
|
posted on March 19, 2005 04:50:29 PM new
I like the organ donation aspect
What exactly are you going to do with all those donated organs. 
Child killers should get the DP. I think that child molesters should get a life sentence with no chance for parole and as far as consentual sex with minors, I think that the age of the child should be taken into account in determining the penalty. I can't believe that any child under the age of about 14 would really know what sex is really all about and be able to make a consentual type decision when promted to do so by someone asking or coaxing.
|
fenix03
|
posted on March 19, 2005 05:06:24 PM new
::What exactly are you going to do with all those donated organs.::
Hey - it's not like we are the only country with a lack of organ donors
~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~
If it's really "common" sense, why do so few people actually have it?
|
yellowstone
|
posted on March 19, 2005 05:13:21 PM new
Yes but I kinda got the feeling that when Parklane metioned organ donation that he was talking about the...well...you know...the thangs.
|
fenix03
|
posted on March 19, 2005 05:30:28 PM new
Possibly - but I'm much more practical 
~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~
If it's really "common" sense, why do so few people actually have it?
|
yellowstone
|
posted on March 19, 2005 05:41:26 PM new
That you are.
|
CBlev65252
|
posted on March 20, 2005 05:43:10 AM new
We have a large problem with child predators where I live. They're everywhere including next to the elementary schools. Tiffany, who is six, goes nowhere alone. Because of her, this problem is very close to my heart.
If there is definitive proof of their guilt, first offense - removal to a deserted island. No electricity, no running water, only the clothes on your back, no conveniences at all. Learn to live off the land Survivor style - for life. No cost to the taxpayer other than getting them there and maybe patrol boats. Make sure they're far enough out to sea to make it impossible to get off safely. Oh, and make sure the waters are shark infested.
Constitutional rights should not apply to these people. They lost them when they first grabbed the child. Appeals? I don't think so. Did he hear the appeals of the child begging for her life? No? Well, we won't hear yours.
It has been proven time and time again that these people cannot be rehabilitated. So what if they didn't kill the child physically. The child was killed mentally and scarred for life. This is one area where I am not liberal.
Cheryl
|
classicrock000
|
posted on March 20, 2005 08:55:38 AM new
"This is one area where I am not liberal"
well cheryl,they always say,there's some good in everyone<snicker>
|
yellowstone
|
posted on March 20, 2005 09:15:24 AM new
When child predators go to prison they are shunned by all the prisoners there as being the lowest forms of life and so their lives are in constant danger. Usually what happens to them because of this is that they are placed in whats called protective custody, which means 23 hours a day in full isolated lockup and 1 hour of isolated yard time/shower time. No one will talk to them, their food has to be brought to them and it's usually spit in before. Imagine doing life in this type situation, it would be a living hell. So Cheryl, I have to disagree with you on the "deserted island" idea, that would be too good for them.
|
CBlev65252
|
posted on March 20, 2005 09:25:15 AM new
Ah, yellowstone, what of the ones that are released on parole? No parole on the island. No way to get off. Eat bugs. No bed. No shelter unless you make your own. But, then, no tools to make it. I think the island would be worse. At least in prison there's a roof over your head and knowing you will have a meal, even if spit in, is better than knowing you may not.
Cheryl
|
yellowstone
|
posted on March 20, 2005 09:35:06 AM new
I should have said also that there should be no chance for parole in their sentencing because in my opinion these people can't be rehabilitated and need to be removed from society permanently. What you are talking about essentially is a death penalty. Do you approve of the death penalty?? I do agree with you that something harsh has to be done to them but look at it realistically.
|
CBlev65252
|
posted on March 20, 2005 09:44:12 AM new
It's not a death sentence. What did people do before all of our modern conveniences? What do they still do in the most primitive areas of the world? They use their wits to survive. They don't go to the local WalMart and buy their clothing. The Native American people survived. The homeless do what they must to survive. It can be done. It's only a death sentence if you aren't motivated enough to survive. Why should I care if they're comfy and cozy?
A life sentence is all well and good, but why should my tax money go to make these evil people more comfortable for life?
I'm not a proponent of the death penalty by any means. I never have been. What I am suggesting at least gives them the chance for survival. If they want to act like animals, treat them like animals and not the domesticated kind.
Cheryl
|
Libra63
|
posted on March 20, 2005 09:50:47 AM new
Cheryl I like you idea about an island. But I am sure there would be someone that would try to rescue them. Someone would find them and bring them back. It is a no win situation and the children and their families are paying a price.
I can't understand when they said that at least 50 child molesters were in that area. That sure seems like a lot. I don't know about Florida but in Wisconsin when a molester is let out of prison it is printed information. The state finds them housing and then if they find a home they have to notify the neighboring community that he is going free and going to live there. Then that neighborhood gets petitions and keeps that person out. And they succeed thank goodness. The island sounds like a perfect place. Let them eat coconuts.
_________________
|
yellowstone
|
posted on March 20, 2005 09:59:32 AM new
[i]It's not a death sentence. What did people do before all of our modern conveniences? What do they still do in the most primitive areas of the world? They use their wits to survive. They don't go to the local WalMart and buy their clothing. The Native American people survived. The homeless do what they must to survive. It can be done. It's only a death sentence if you aren't motivated enough to survive. Why should I care if they're comfy and cozy?[i]
Survival wits are learned over time and passed down from generations, they don't come naturally, so essentially you are advocating a slow death sentence. I don't care if they are comfy and cozy either and thus being locked up and isolated for life knowing that everyone hates you and some want to kill you and you have no way to defend yourself would be a living hell.
|
yellowstone
|
posted on March 20, 2005 10:13:39 AM new
You send someone out into a survival situation without any sort of survival training and they will be dead within a couple of months. So Cheryl, you are advocating the death sentence, it's just that your form of death is slow and painfull rather that quick and harsh.
|
Linda_K
|
posted on March 20, 2005 01:05:45 PM new
Good point, yellowstone.
----------------------
Plus while we can 'dream' of what we might like to see happen to them....and understandably...the reality is groups like the ACLU and the other bleeding heart groups would be in there fighting for their humane treatment....even though they aren't human imo.
In regards to the death penalty, some who are totally opposed to the death penalty and only make the exception when it comes to 'child killers/molesters', I don't understand. I wonder why they don't see adults who murder other adults deserving the DP or 'this off to an isolated island' in the same way. After all, they too have murdered someones child. Just because the victims were adults, doesn't mean they had a better 'chance' of escaping the violence from these same 'types' of misfits in society.
|
