posted on February 15, 2001 02:06:04 PM new
I just watched something on the news that just makes me absolutely sick.
A man left his 2 dogs locked up in his basement with no food or water for 2 weeks. The man abandoned his home and his dogs. The dogs were so hungry, one ate a towel and it couldn't digest it and it died. The other one was found just in time (neighbors reported non-stop barking I guess) and the dog had not eaten in 2 weeks.
This kind of news just infuriates me. Those poor animals.
The headline on this story was "is punishment for animal cruelty strong enough?".
posted on February 15, 2001 02:23:28 PM new
That's how my sister got her last dog. Some total jerk moved and left a mother and puppies with no food or water. By the time the cops came the mother dog was dead and only one pup was alive. My brother-in-law was one of the cops that answered the call. He kept the pup, had it for years. She was 14 when she died.
I think anyone who treats animals that way should get the same treatment.
posted on February 15, 2001 02:44:44 PM new
Animal cruelty laws are not strict enough because many (most?) people think animals are far less important than humans. My first impulse is to call that egocentric, but a more accurate term is probably something along the lines of "humanocentric."
Those who are cruel to animals don't think they're much different than objects like toys and furniture, when the truth is that animals are just like us, only in different packages.
Lately I've been feeling guilty that I eat varied meals when I feed my cats the same food every day. If I had kids I wouldn't feed them the same thing every day.
posted on February 15, 2001 03:09:58 PM new
Rainy Bear Don't feel bad about feeding your cats the same food every day. I have read that it's good for them. They don't need variety like we do. Animal cruelty is one of the worst forms of abuse in my mind. It makes me sick. If I ever actually saw someone doing it, I might come very close to killing the person.
"If man were to be crossed with a cat, it would greatly improve the man, but deteriorate the cat." Mark Twain
posted on February 15, 2001 03:17:35 PM new
Moonmem, I just feel bad because I have one cat who begs at the table like a dog and he makes me feel sooooo guilty!
posted on February 15, 2001 03:26:25 PM new
Rainybear, I have a cat that begs as well. Sometimes he has only just been fed ( and a lot of the time I put out cut up steak for him with his biscuits), and he is still begging my husband for food.
Now with cruelty to animals, they should be locked away. We have a law in my State that says it is a criminal offence to impose any acts of cruelty to animals large or small. It may range from a fine for not feeding your horse to imprisonment for kicking your dog ect. That is the way it should be too....
posted on February 15, 2001 03:27:04 PM new
Makes you wonder who the real "animals" are in this world. Starving to death is too good for these idiots.
Rainybear...as tempting as it may be, try not to give tablescraps to the cat. Their systems can't handle certain foods and they can get digestive problems. It's hard to resist those eyes though!
posted on February 15, 2001 03:33:15 PM new
Animals begging I used to have a cat named Peever (she died of kidney problems). If she could get next to you when you were eating, she would put set a paw on your leg or arm and then stare at you. It would drive me crazy! Now I have 2 beggers and 2 nonbeggers. Thinking about how much pets have added to my life, I don't know how people can be cruel to them.
posted on February 15, 2001 03:57:57 PM new
My cat won't eat the same thing everyday. She won't eat any beef cat food either. She doesn't care much for tuna, but loves salmon. Between my picky eater husband and my picky eater cat I'm going crazy. The dog and I are the only sane ones here, and she's watching me real close.
posted on February 15, 2001 06:51:57 PM new
We had a case here in MI of a person who had very strong views about political correctness and starved his cat to death because he insisted as a matter of belief that any form of life in God's creation can live on a vegetarian diet. He is 100% sure he is as righteous as the rain and won't believe the cat starved to death. I guess the only fair punishment would be to lock him up with as much water and grass as he wants.
posted on February 15, 2001 08:39:36 PM new
Gravid
Sounds like he doesn't have enough brains left to form intent to starve the cat.
I have a friend who is a vegetarian...will not eat anything with a
face or a mother! BUT, she cooks chicken breasts and other gourmet dishes for the cat.
Anybody having dinner with her is usually wishing that they could be dining with the cat!
posted on February 15, 2001 09:13:35 PM new
Oh well then, dog runs are cruel, and so is the 'genetic enigineering' of breeding for desired traights, especially small or large size. The entire class of animals known as 'miniature' are mutations propogated by humans for their own amusement or convenience.
posted on February 15, 2001 10:12:34 PM newRainy
Not sure if u were in the Jet City at the time, but someone else here may be able to "fill in" this story a little more.
If memory serves it was @ 93-94...there was a small "farm/park" in the burbs with a donkey (Pedro?) that all the kids used to come and pet, feed, and love....
One night 3 teens snuck in and tied "Pedro" to a tree and beat him to death with a 2x4!!!
The one weilding the lumber was charged as an adult, because authorities thought that if a child that young (13 or 14) had such cruel intentions at that age, they were a DEFINITE threat to society later in life.
Wish I could remember more details, but it has been a few years.
Keith
I assume full responsibility for my actions, except
the ones that are someone else's fault.
posted on February 15, 2001 11:28:33 PM new
In the last few years they have toughened up our laws in this state for animal cruelty, I think it's a felony here but don't quote me. Now the Sheriff's dept. handles all animal cruelty here and we're the home of "America's toughest Sheriff". Joe Arpaio gets downright pissed when he's asked about cases. We had a recent one here and I saw a blip of him on the news. He was spitting nails mad at the guy! People who treat animals like 'things' are just things in my eyes.
~~Angels fly because they take themselves lightly ~~
posted on February 16, 2001 08:20:47 AM newubiedaman - that donkey's name was Pasado, and I don't know all the details either, but there's now an animal rescue place up in Shelton called Pasado's Safe Haven. They take in animals (mainly farm animals) who have been the victims of cruelty and/or neglect.
posted on February 16, 2001 04:14:10 PM new
krs- i am usually more or less in agreement with your posts. i can't, however, understand(assuming you were serious) why you think that breeding dogs for size is cruel or that such dogs are "mutations". there is no "abuse" in the breeding process as far as i know and small dogs are generally pampered more than large ones. in fact, if you think about it, breeding the smallest dogs together is probably less "uncomfortable" than allowing a large one and a small one to mate. regarding dog runs, i would think that those that are used by owners to protect their lawns are occupied by the dogs only periodically. allowing a dog to "live" in one could be considered cruel but i can't imagine too many owners using them for that purpose.
posted on February 16, 2001 04:50:18 PM new
Stusi,
The breeding of animals for desired traits is unnatural and frequently results in many serious problems in the animals associated with inadequate area for, or in sufficient development of, the internal organs of the animals in small ones, and insufficient organ capacity in large ones. You can see the difference in the carriage and posture of miniaturized versions when compared to full growth versions, and the short lives and serious bone structure and premature joint displasia afflictions in large ones are much worse than those inherent to the larger breeds. In the former, they're all scrunched together, in the latter there is no strength of heart and bone to support the creature through it's life in any normal way.
In goldfish, for example, those pretty ones with the short bodies and long fin areas are bred to be that way and you can actually see the effects on their internal organs through their outer layer. The worst I've seen in dogs was (may still be) the arab country apparent competition to have the largest dog resulted in St. Bernards which weighed in excess of 650 lbs and were as large as small ponies. In many cases they didn't live to be three years old, and most didn't make it that long. Their hearts could not be made to grow as their bodies could.
Dog runs to protect a lawn. Yes. The lawn is important isn't it? More so than the psychological well being of the pet. They make me sick and I wonder why such people even have animals as pets. Let them buy convenient toys to put away when not in use. Imagine a dog, locked up in those slammers called "dog runs" hearing that big door slam shut and the key rattling in the lock, in for indeterminate sentence at the whim of the people who claim to 'love' him or her, with cement to grind down claws and nothing but the undignified free air before an open fence to relieve themselves in, wondering why, and again why is it called a dog run?
Where can I run??
Look back at any dog's eyes when he's just been locked up again. He's unable to speak, but if he could he'd say "Please don't put me in here again! What did I do....I want to be with you......I love you."
posted on February 16, 2001 05:40:37 PM new
krs- you have enlightened me regarding some consequences of the selective breeding process. however, how do you explain the fact that toy poodles(mine was not bought from a breeder) have one of the longest average lifespans of any breed? you make an impassioned case regarding dog runs and i am not in any way suggesting that a lawn is nearly as important as the well being of a dog. however i think that it is a question of degree. a dog will quickly get acclimated to using a run(i do not have one) for a short period of time to do its business. i never really thought about this being a cruel practice. the story about the st. bernards is sickening as the larger breeds are well known to have much shorter life spans.
posted on February 16, 2001 05:49:43 PM new
This kind of abandonment cruely is more prevelant than one might think. I was a cleaning woman at an apartment complex for just three months and twice I found abandoned animals.
In one unit a puppy was left, the only water was the toilet and it was running out there was a huge bag of dog food on top of a dining table unopened and unreachable. Lots of bent and burned spoons laying around too, so you know where their heads were (up their arses) We found the puppy a good home
The other was an apartment we did not know had become vacant. A cat was in there for a weeks or so, she had no food, and not even any water, the toilet lids were closed. She had no litter box so she had gone along the edges of the living room. When I opened the door something shot out and we never found the poor thing so that we could feed or help her.
I completely and totally agree with you on the dog runs, the cages and all of it.
But, Dogs have been bred for centuries and centuries towards a human need or want or flight of fancy. Some have worked and some haven't. You can't really just point at the toy breeds.
posted on February 16, 2001 06:04:17 PM new
I have to agree with krs. Some of the miniatures may live a long time but at what cost? They have nervous problems - how many of you have seen chihuahas that actually shake all the time? The poodles are unable to hold their bladder and have skin problems. I have seen old ladies keep some of these dogs alive in pain with arthritis and heart disease giving them insulin shots every day and unable to enjoy life, for their own selfish feelings, that was as bad
as any doctor keeping a human alive when they basically had no one home anymore.
posted on February 16, 2001 06:45:17 PM new
I was just thinking about how animals are used in medical research.
What do you think about this? Is it cruelty?
posted on February 16, 2001 07:56:39 PM new
HJW - Of course some of it is cruel. But I am human centered enough to say being cruel needlessly is wrong but sometimes causing discomfort to research a serious medical problem that causes huge suffering in humans is worth causing limited suffering to some animals. Sometimes it is worth causing suffering in humans if they give informed consent to help research a disease or treatment.
Buy how can you justly balance the importance of something like testing cosmetics when there is no pressing need?
posted on February 16, 2001 08:39:59 PM new
HJW and Gravid,
Please read A Dogs Tale by Mark Twain if you can find it. I can't find it on the web and do not relish the idea of typing the entire story here. What it is: The very first and most amazing writing I have come across on the subject of experimenting on animals. The story is told in such a way (as only Twain could write it)
In such a way that could make even the most staunch supporter of animal experimentation waver.
Written so many years ago..... The piece was not widely published I imagine, in a time when animals, children and women could be beaten almost to death without a risk of prison and in some cases without a risk of losing ones chums.
If I remember correctly, animal protection laws came before child protective laws, but it was all mind yer damn business at the time of this writing.
posted on February 16, 2001 09:16:11 PM new
A few years back we went to Florida and gave the keys and some money to my brother-in-law to take care of my dog while we were gone. We were going for 10 days.I made sure that my dog had water and food before we left. We were driving there so it took us two days to get there. After we got to Florida I called my brother-in-law to see how my dog was. My sister-in-law told me he was fine. Everyday I would call to find out how the dog was. My brother-in-law would never come to the phone. There was always an excuse why he couldn't come to the phone. But his wife would tell me everything was fine. The day before we were to leave Florida he finnally came to the phone and told us he had lost the keys to the house and had not fed or given the dog water the whole time we were gone. I was so upset. I had visions that I would come home and find my dog dead. At that time it was going on 8 days since we had left. I was hoping at the best that we had left the bathroom door open so he could at least gotten some water out of the toilet. Needless to say that we left Florida that day. Trying to race home for our dog. We got home and the dog was fine. Hungry and thirsty. But okay. I was so mad at my brother-in-law for that for months. If he had just told us in the beginning we could have come home or tried to make other arrangments. To have his wife tell me everything is fine. How long did they think that a animal could go without food or water is beyond me. He was going to just let my dog die possibly from a lack of water. To me that was just plain cruel.
posted on February 16, 2001 10:34:48 PM new
Please allow me to share another tale of animal cruelty, an act also perpetuated by a family member.
Last spring, I wrote on these boards my frustrations regarding a relative's cavalier attitude regarding my mom's dog she had volunteered to care for. My mom died in late August 99 after a debilitating struggle with colon cancer. The dog was her sole companion after my dad died in 1993.
I brought my mom's dog home with me and tried to acclimate her in my home. She is a small poodle terrier mix and at the time was nine years old and blind. I already owned a rambunctious 80 pound Bouvier/Chow mix who was two at the time.
Needless to say, there were problems. My mom's dog was grieving. My big dog couldn't understand why this new little dog who couldn't see him didn't want to play. In steps the relative. I agreed to continue paying for her food and medical attention. The cousin agreed to provide my mom's dog with love, companionship and attention.
How stupid I was.
There were signs that she was not caring for the dog properly, but I was too self-absorbed in my own life to notice until things got progressively worse.
I noticed that my mom's dog looked like she was losing weight. Then my cousin's mother (my aunt and my mother's sister who suggested this arrangement) got very ill and was hospitalized for treatment. My cousin spent every waking moment at the hospital, which I don't begrudge her. It's her mother after all.
But every time I asked about my mom's dog, she gave the same reply: Nini was OK, which could not have been right, since my cousin never seemed to be at home.
Then, one night, after working a really long day, a message was waiting for me at home on my answering machine: It was a local vet's office calling asking if I was the owner of a dog named Nini.
My mom had had Nini microchipped. They called my mom's vet, who gave them my name and telephone number. The office was closed by the time I got home. When I called the first thing the next morning, they told me Nini was in really bad shape, was nothing but skin and bones, had sores on her feet, legs and was so matted they had to shave off much of her hair.
When my cousin took her, she weighed 17 pounds. She was down to nine. I didn't recognize her when I got to the vet's office. I cried as I held her, cursing myself for being so foolish to think someone might provide her the love and attention she was accustomed to. My cousin, I later learned, had given her to some woman who dumped Nini in a local park, located near a very busy thoroughfare.
A retired minister saw Nini, confused and disoriented, trying to make her way. I bless her for stopping and for caring. She took her to the vet's office. It took about a month for her to fully regain her strength. Her weight is back up where it should be. She and my other dog, though they have their moments, get along OK. I met and had lunch with the kind minister. I have had no further contact with my cousin after cursing her for her obvious neglect and abuse.
I apologize for this being so long, but I wanted to share my story. Nini is all that I have left of my mom, besides good memories and other personal mementos. I miss my mom and my dad. When I come home each day and are greeted by two happy doggies who only ask for love and attention, I think about my parents and all that they tried to teach and instill in me.
~~