krs
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posted on May 2, 2001 04:49:54 PM new
Remember the flap in the military over Bush's plan to have all regular (not airborne or ranger) forces wear black berets?
Well, the feathers won't be ruffled now. The US has broken all military contact with the Chinese, and since it had been impossible to meet Bush's beret deadline without using berets that had China origin content or manufacture, all orders have been cancelled or will be sent back.
This should sooth those in the military who felt aggrieved that such people as personnel or finance clerks would be sporting berets normally reserved for elite or military police units.
The ramifications of this new disruption of relations with China are certainly secondary issues.
http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/ap/20010502/pl/black_berets_1.html
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Borillar
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posted on May 2, 2001 05:39:55 PM new
It'll still be a problem, as Bush fully intends on going ahead with his plan, however belated. Th elite forces will be wearing pansey tan Berets and the cooks and the grease monkeys will get to wear the elite black beret - made in Another Country Who Hasn't Embarrased Bush.
The question is, is it possible to embarass Bush?
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anthro1966
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posted on May 2, 2001 06:16:55 PM new
Although I disagreed w/ the black berets I still agree that the army should get berets. We're probably still one of the few army's in the world that doesn't wear a beret of some kind.
FYI the berets are only for the army and army MPs don't wear berets - that's the Air Force.
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jlpiece
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posted on May 2, 2001 10:08:19 PM new
I still think it was a terrible call. Why not let them wear a different color. The special forces work too hard to get the black beret.
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krs
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posted on May 2, 2001 10:14:24 PM new
They aren't green? John Wayne wore green.
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jlpiece
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posted on May 2, 2001 10:15:18 PM new
How about purple? I know that would go over nice.
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krs
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posted on May 2, 2001 10:25:00 PM new
That be for the Marines. But they'd call it Lavender.
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mark090
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posted on May 3, 2001 07:50:03 AM new
Black Berets are worn by Rangers
Green Berets are worn by Special Forces
Dark Burgundy/Purple are worn by Airborne, I think?
They could have picked a different color for the rest of the military, the above colors have too much pride and history to be diluted by widespread use.
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auctiongallery2
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posted on May 3, 2001 11:45:17 AM new
I find it silly that people would be so upset over what color or type of head covering they have to wear.
And I guess this is the most important issue to come out of this whole flap with the Chinese? The color of a beret...LOL
AG2
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jamesoblivion
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posted on May 3, 2001 11:50:01 AM new
It's not the color of the hat, obviously. It's the symbolism attached to it.
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auctiongallery2
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posted on May 3, 2001 12:21:55 PM new
Still far more important things to worry about than even "symbolism."
AG2
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jamesoblivion
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posted on May 3, 2001 12:23:12 PM new
No matter what you worry about there is always something more important to worry about.
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wisegirl
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posted on May 3, 2001 12:44:21 PM new
It is the symbolism. At the risk of sounding too patriotic, groups such as the Rangers have a proud heritage, and their black berets symbolize that heritage, both to them and to the outside world. Something that serves as a unifying, bonding element for groups such as the Rangers should be left alone. "LOL" is not the appropriate reaction when these men are willing to die for their country. And, I might add, for you.
The decision by Shinseki to dilute the meaning of the black berets by giving them to everyone (except paratroopers and Special Forces) was ill-advised. So I agree with you, mark090; it would have been better had Shinseki opted to let the Rangers keep their black berets and use tan for the all-purpose Army berets. It's a no-brainer and I don't blame the Rangers for being upset, so there's a nice symmetry to what has happened.
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krs
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posted on May 3, 2001 12:47:12 PM new
LoL!
James! That's a stereotype.
It's all moot now because relations with China are back on. The Chinese are confusiouned, and so is the Bush administration, but everybody already knew that.
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kraftdinner
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posted on May 3, 2001 01:02:29 PM new
james - 
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Hjw
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posted on May 3, 2001 01:45:20 PM new
James, Now that puts everything in perspective! Good one!!! 
Helen
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mybiddness
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posted on May 3, 2001 02:22:06 PM new
O.K. I'll bite.
How was this Bush's plan when the beret decision was made and the orders placed months before he was in office?
Not paranoid anywhere else but here!
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auctiongallery2
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posted on May 3, 2001 02:32:59 PM new
"LOL" is appropriate when people are upset about the color of a hat.
Yes these people have taken upon themselves to put their lives on the line for our country...not to make fashion statements.
This is more about seperating themselves from others in their same field...wanting to feel prominent.
Who's life is more important on the battlefield?
#1 The Ranger with the black beret
or
#2 The army chef.
Both jobs require each of them to go to battle and put their lives on the line.
It's not a badge, a medal, or a hat that makes you honourable.
It has more to do with how you lead your life, how you treat your fellow man (or woman).
And with that said there are many honourable people in this world. But you don't see them complaining that someone is wearing a black beret.
AG2
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spazmodeus
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posted on May 3, 2001 02:34:26 PM new
Evolution of the beret.
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anthro1966
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posted on May 3, 2001 02:34:37 PM new
Good point Mybiddness. General Shinseki (who I used to work for in Germany) is the one who came up with the idea of the berets. President Bush had nothing to do with it. General Shinseki is also the one pushing through the concept of light, wheeled, rapid deployable army units.
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mybiddness
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posted on May 3, 2001 02:42:52 PM new
I've been very curious about the relationship or opinion that General Shinseki and Bush have of one another but haven't found anything referencing it on the web or local paper.
My question is whether Bush supported Shinseki after the fact... I can't find anything related to that but I'm not very good at digging up info on the web.
Not paranoid anywhere else but here!
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HJW
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posted on May 3, 2001 03:25:19 PM new
Spaz,
Looks like you have been playing with Muriel.
Helen
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MuRiEl
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posted on May 3, 2001 05:28:19 PM new
I was just going to say how jealous I was of that WONDERFUL GIF!!! I cannot compete with that one. I am not worthy. 
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krs
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posted on May 3, 2001 07:51:20 PM new
Console yourself.
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zilvy
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posted on May 3, 2001 07:53:49 PM new
Heeee's baaaacckkkk! The Greek bearing Gifs...I've been told "HE" has the greatest GIF collection in all of AW and beyond...
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Bunnicula
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posted on May 3, 2001 07:59:01 PM new
auctiongallery2: Actually, it is more than the color of the beret. It is about recognition & credit for superior effort or work. This beret business is like an extension of the crap that is going on in our schools with the abolition of grades and the ascendency of the "self esteem" claptrap. In the schools, kids who put in the hard work & give that extra "oomph" find that kids who do the bare minimum & can barely read are getting the same comment as themselves: satisfactory. Our country is sending the message to its people that mediocre is enough, and that putting in extra effort isn't going to be rewarded. Rangers, Special Forces, Seals, etc. put in extra effort & deserve the recognition. Some things in life have to be earned, not just awarded merely because you are breathing.
edited to put "are" where it will do the most good...
[ edited by Bunnicula on May 3, 2001 09:20 PM ]
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jlpiece
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posted on May 3, 2001 09:09:08 PM new
Well Said.
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