posted on April 21, 2000 02:30:56 PM new
Oh dear, my last thread was deleted because I violated the "community guidelines" for this board. Therefore, I'm going to post again in hopes I can get some opinions.
I recently was the high bidder on an auction at Yahoo for a laptop computer. The auction was done by a new seller and was worded in a legitimate manner. I figured the person knew what she was speaking of and was honestly a new seller.
Said auction completed, and seller contacted me with payment procedure. I sent a USPS Money Order to the seller and I'm now fairly sure I've been taken for a proverbial ride.
I have contacted the USPS Postal Police and lodged a complaint. Furthermore, I've contacted the Attorneys General of the states where I live and where the seller lives (not sure if the community guidelines allow me to post them here) as well as www.fraud.org. I'm hoping to be able to get my money back somehow, but many posts on here have me thinking that I'll have a better shot at seeing Jesus.
Seller did contact me via email yesterday to tell me she does not know why my merchandise did not arrive, and promised me a refund. But I smell a rat.
Other than what I've stated, does anyone have any ideas on how I could get my money back? I wonder if I can file against the seller in small claims court in my own state. Has anyone here been party to something like this and been successful in regaining funds? If so, how? I'm out almost $500.
posted on April 21, 2000 03:08:39 PM new
your remark i will never bid on a yahoo auction again makes it seem that all of the sellers are crooks and thats not the case their are some really good sellers on y!AUCTIONS what is this sellers user name youve done just about all you can do
posted on April 21, 2000 03:26:42 PM new
I'm sure there's some really good sellers on Yahoo. But with the lack of support for both buyer and seller through Yahoo, I think I'm going to stick to eBay for my bidding.
posted on April 21, 2000 06:16:18 PM new
I got taken for $25 once by a rip off seller but didn't find it worth the trouble to go through all that reporting. I certainly was furious though I can imagine how you feel. Here are 2 other organizations I know of:
The seller who ripped me off had 5 postives so I didn't really look at them closely. After I figured out something was wrong I did and realized they had all been posted within hours of auction close yet said "Great seller, item carefully packaged, arrived in great condition, recommend this person etc.
Everyone needs to study those feedbacks for phonies, when they use another ID to give themselves the positives they don't seem to realize the auct title line and feedbacks are date and time stamped, or either they think bidders won't notice. That kind of info is good to have to prove fraud.
When shopping for high ticket items be sure to stick to eBAy, at least they have insurance on all sales. They will also help pursue criminal charges. Reporting ripoffs to Yahoo does no good at all, all you get is a form letter saying Sorry you were cheated but it's not our responsibility. Then they tell you to file a fraud complaint with the FTC. When you go to FTC's website though it says you can ONLY file against a business, not a person.
posted on April 21, 2000 07:16:26 PM new
The ray of sunshine I'm referring to has posted negative feedback about me at Yahoo. It is now becoming apparent to me that I've been had. Legal battles await, I'll assume.
Anyone know if I can sue someone from another state in small claims court?
posted on April 21, 2000 08:23:43 PM new
The odds of being ripped off are not allocated to just one auction. It is the seller,not the auctions you need to deal with. The other posts areright - I am a ebay AND yahoo seller - so the discrimination of which auction is good and bad doesn't compute. Perhaps you really should wait to see if you get a refund - if it is insured there should be a way to recoup. That is if the ins is in YOUR name. If it is in Seller name - they get the refund but need to refund you in any case. There are many, many sellers and a few bad apples on ALL auctions. Please don't advertise that we are all crooks over here - not so..........I have a HIGH ebay f/back and am honest on whatever auction I sell on. Hope this works out for you. but give it some time before you take any action. yahoo does care and will dump a bad seller.
posted on April 21, 2000 08:31:54 PM new
Thanks to those who provided me with information on how i could get help. I have since submitted this issue to the CT and IL AG, the Web Police, the USPS Postal Police and the National Center for Internet Fraud (or something such as that).
But to those I've obviously insulted...it's now my opinion that Yahoo is not as secure as eBay. Hence, I will no longer bid at Yahoo to protect my proverbial backside.
And since the seller has now gone quite silent, I'm sure that my instinct telling me that I smell a rat is right.
posted on April 22, 2000 04:26:00 AM new
It was worded in this manner: "IS A CROOK. EITHER HAD SOMEONE SIGN FOR LAPTOP OR SIGNED FOR IT HIMSELF USING A DIFFERENT NAME THEN DEMANDED A REFUND. HARRASSES YOU ENDLESSLY AND MAKES CONSTANT THREATS UNTIL HE HAS BOTH YOU MERCHANDISE AND HIS MONEY BACK SELLERS....PLEASE BEWARE!!!!!"
This was posted AFTER the seller promised a refund. I'm obviously being fleeced and have filed five complaints against this person. And I'm not stopping until I'm repaid or I get my computer.
posted on April 22, 2000 07:27:24 AM new
Why did you spend $500 buying from a seller with no feedback?. Well its probably too late now. As to not buying in Yahoo, well I sell in Yahoo but its your decision. There are crooks everywhere, you just have to be very careful especially buying from someone you've never met rather than a business (waiting for backlash).
Heck if Jose is returning to Bolivia in 2 weeks, what's to stop him from selling & then running back to Bolivia. What are you going to do, run to Bolivia & catch him?. Fortunately there are many honest Joes here & I think the honest Joes outnumber the seller running to Bolivia scenario.
Yup your chances of getting your Money is between slim to zero.
BTW if this is the eBay Outlook, this is what happens. So don't get mad your thread was locked. Be thankful that seller does not appear to want to come in to AW.
1. Invite the criminal in for discussion
2. Other members of AW who has no business with the transaction gets involve
3. Everyone picks a side. Battle line drawn. Nosey members starts discussion in all seriousness trying to resolve issue at hand & hopefully to pat themselves on their back (Good job Joe...hey you did well George).
4. The constituiton gets thrown in, freedom of speech is invoked. A lawyer is suggested. Thread degrades into trash talk
5. Name callings. (Joe you bloody idiot...no George you are stamping on my freedom of speech, you piece of pork loins)
6. Moderator called. Someone gets suspended.
7. Starts new thread. Locked immediately.
8. Joe & George waits for new not their business issue & pretend they can solve everyone's auction problem because they have way too much time.
posted on April 22, 2000 07:57:43 AM new
One thing that was asked was why I bid on an auction given by a person with no feedback. Well, I started auctioning things with no feedback and was successful. I figured this was someone starting out like I did two years ago.
But the one thing I do have on my side is the fact that the seller wasn't bright enough to use an address that wasn't connected to a listed phone number. Calling Chicago information revealed that the name, address and phone number were legit. The USPS Postal Police says that since there is a valid name, address and phone number involved, the person at that residence to whom the money order is endorsed should be responsible if and when the money order is cashed.
Both state AGs seem to think they can get my cash since I have a valid and real human being and address on my side. And with FIVE complaints filed, I think someone is going to be successful.
But the money order hasn't been cashed yet, so that's something rather interesting.
There could be a good resolution to this, we'll see...
[message edited to delete testy comments...sorry]
[ edited by apbabruce on Apr 22, 2000 08:10 AM ]
posted on April 22, 2000 08:50:07 AM new
AS angry as the neg this person left seems it sounds as if not only did they send out your Item to you though you say you havent got it they sent it with comfermation and have receive that back as deliverd to some one but also the warning would say to me that your refund is on its way.
you could takethis to small claims court in there city or yours but both partys would have to be present in the court and even winning dont garentee a refund and if you lose will cost you up to $250 to get your case heard there.
so if win or lose in the end that way you could be out $750 .
posted on April 22, 2000 09:36:13 AM new
Couldn't the $250 fee be recoup'ed from the defendent? You know...$500.00 plus court costs? But that puts it over the $500.00 small claims limit.....
posted on April 22, 2000 09:59:06 AM new
Yes if you win in small claims court the fee is paid by the other loseing party but winning in small claims is no garentee of getting refund easy to win hard to collect.
you would definately gain satisfaction that you did something and maybe your money.
thing is both partys must be in the court at the time. at this point if one is in NY one in CA then you have travel costs as well inless you could like get the case on TV court like judge judy where all exspenes would be paid for both sides
posted on April 22, 2000 11:27:17 AM new
Well, one of the things that bothers me about the whole thing is the fact that I've begged for a tracking number and been refused. Seller refuses to acknowledge my requests. Therefore, I believe him to be lying.
With five agencies chasing the seller, I'm working hard to get some satisfaction.
posted on April 23, 2000 05:50:55 AM new
Looks like the seller is getting more and more nasty...seller still insists I have the merchandise. If that's true, seller sent an invisible laptop because I can't see it anywhere.
Here's the latest retort...I WAS NICE ENOUGH TO REFUND YOUR MONEY AND WOULD NOW LIKE FOR YOU TO RETURN THE FAVOR BY RETURNING MY
LAPTOP! IT WAS SIGNED FOR AND I REFUSE TO BELIEVE THAT YOU DO NOT HAVE IT CONSIDERING THE WAY YOU HAVE CONDUCTED YOURSELF PREVIOUSLY! PLEASE RETURN THE
LAPTOP BY THURSDAY OF NEXT WEEK (4/27/2000) AS ACTION IS ALREADY BEING TAKEN AGAINST YOU. I DO NOT MAKE FALSE CLAIMS AS YOU HAVE DONE, I HAVE ALREADY TRIED TO
AVOID ANY PROBLEMS WITH YOU AND ALL YOU SEEMED TO WANT TO DO WAS CREATE MORE. RETRUN THE LAPTOP BY THURSDAY. THANK YOU.
Keeping in mind seller still completely refuses to give me any tracking information, I don't take any heed of these comments. I still smell a rat.
posted on April 23, 2000 06:19:45 AM new
I have said this here before and I will say it again
it sounds to me as if the seller sent out your ITEM and it got to the wrong person now there is miss trust and missunderstanding on both sides.
it is more then clear that if they are honest enough to send you a refund they prolly sent the lap top to
best thing to do in this case is to stop accuseing each other and start searching and see who this lap top got to and who signed for it it could be a simple as one of your neighbors has got it,
or the seller messed up and sent a few packages with wrong addresses and the person on the other end who bought the hallmark decoration or what ever received a laptop and isnt going to say a word about it .
if she did send the item with delivery comformation of some type this can be traced . but in order for this to happen someone has to stop the insanity long enough to think
if this laptop sits right in your neighborhood , at someone elses house you werent home they seen a package for you and signed for it either being nice or being dishonest you will be red faced .
or if it was the sellers mistake and it was sent to another buyer .
posted on April 23, 2000 06:59:50 AM new
Well, I'd tend to agree. If the laptop indeed has arrived to a neighbor (and that neighbor isn't as honest as we'd like to think our neighbors are), then I'm an idiot. But nobody in the neighborhood has come forth saying a package arrived, and when I asked my 3 neighbors (on each side of me and across the street) none of them knew what I was talking about.
But in arguing with this person, I've repeatedly asked for a tracking number for the package. The seller has repeatedly failed to acknowledge the request for that information by continuing the shouting and nastiness. If this laptop was indeed sent and in fact signed for, wouldn't the seller be happy to give out the tracking number in order to gain assistance in finding the blasted thing? The seller has provided me with no tangible evidence that the laptop was ever mailed.
Any ideas? I haven't even told the seller I've filed against him/her. But with the lack of information coming from him/her, I have no choice other than to feel stiffed.
[edited to clean up my grammatical mistakes...thank goodness I teach math, eh?]
[ edited by apbabruce on Apr 23, 2000 07:01 AM ]
posted on April 23, 2000 07:59:47 AM new
yeah I do understand your confusion for sure. problem here if that the seller is angree to make sense.
it really pretty wild for then to acuse you of haveing the item even if even if they used DC the PO dont garentee that it was dilvered to you just that it was dilivered.
giveing you the tracking number would sure make things move faster since you could check at your local postoffice and they can tell you in which PO the delivery was made to maybe even to what address
the seller could do this them selves and when they calm down I am sure if there is a tracking number they will check it out this money isnt only hard for you to lose but they are out twice .
in any case it sound like they are makeing good and your refund is on the way you already filed claim and I would hold off on any contact for a fair amount of time and give it a rest you know like till you feel the refund should have had time to get to you .
I do feel for you for sure feeling your out near $500 would make the toughest of us skip more then a few heart beats.
posted on April 23, 2000 06:53:47 PM new
Well, today I received the same email from my friend FIVE TIMES regarding the infamous laptop deal gone bad. Each time, I've replied asking for tracking information that would allow me to find the damn thing and successfully complete the transaction. Each time, the request falls upon deaf ears.
The tracking information I constantly request can be used online at USPS.com or UPS.com to track packages. It is my opinion that the seller knows this therefore ignores pleas for this material. By giving me false information, it would be too easy to divulge the seller as a rat.
I'm therefore going to assume this seller's shouts and accusations are full of sound and fury signifying nothing. Hopefully, the seller did indeed send my refund. I rather doubt it.
[ edited by apbabruce on Apr 23, 2000 06:58 PM ]
posted on April 24, 2000 05:37:26 AM new
Delivery Confirmation for the most part is useless. I learned this the hard way. It does not have to be signed for. When it is delivered, the bar code is scanned...that is it. It can be left anywhere. The USPS does not know and cannot tell you who has it, only that it was delivered to a certain zip code.
I know this for a fact because I sent a very large payment to a tanning bed company. I sent it Priority Mail with Delivery Confirmation on it. The Company misplaced it. I called the USPS and asked them if they could tell me where it was delivered to and they told me that it was delivered on a certain day to this zip code, however they could not tell me WHERE it was delivered to or who had it!!
I asked the Post Master at my Post Office and they said that in order to have someone sign for something it had to be sent Registered Mail. Not just Delivery Confirmation.
So there is no way either of you could tell who had it just with Delivery Confirmation anyway. IF this is what you are being told, then you are being lied to. If it was insured or sent by registered mail then you both would be able to know who signed for it, but like I said, NO ONE signs for Delivery Confirmation packages. They can be left on doorsteps or anywhere. The Postal worker just scans that little bar code and considers it DELIVERED....
Like I said before, I know this to be a FACT. So if they won't give you a no. of any kind, you my friend are being taken for a ride.
(I'll just about bet they know everything that I just typed in here too!)
posted on April 24, 2000 06:29:34 AM new
You're right, I did know everything you just told me!
Yet, if the machine was sent Priority Mail with a signature requested (as the seller says it was), there should be a tracking number for the seller to provide me. Unfortunately, requests for that number have fallen on deaf ears. The seller seemingly refuses to provide such information.
I'm certain I'm being taken for a ride and am going to work damn hard to get my money back. I've already spoken this morning with a representative from www.fraud.org (they get to work early...geez) who says they're going to look into it since the name, address and phone number I've provided them (of the seller) seems to be valid. The USPS Postal Police is on the lookout for the money order and will trace it backwards if it is cashed. And I'm still awaiting the Attorneys General of the states of IL and CT to tell me what initial contact with the seller will bring for them.
All in all, I've got a lot of legal representatives working on this...someone is going to be successful for me.
The one thing that is very interesting to me is the times of day the seller is emailing me yelling and screaming for the return of the mythical laptop. The majority of the emails have been at times when it would seem a child is not in school and possibly unsupervised. Emails come very late in the evening (around 1 AM), any time on Saturday (mostly very late) and Sunday (all afternoon). I expected a response to my latest list of questions concerning tracking information this morning (a whacked out, angry response) and got nothing. The silence was deafening. I'm wondering if the seller is in school this morning.
And my call to Chicago last week was answered by a six year old child who gave the phone to a teen aged boy who gave a series of one word answers. I wonder if I scared the heck out of someone when I tracked down a phone number? I guess it's just wait and see...
posted on April 24, 2000 10:06:41 AM new
This is even worst, if this is a minor involve all he will gt is a slap on the wrist & his mummy will probably suspend his computer rights for 2 weeks.
Nobody is going to persucute a kid, forget it. Unless the kid commits murder, he is consider a prankster. Basically that means a stern warning & the end. You might get into trouble with the parents though. If they are from a middle class family with money, mummy might get a lawyer & sue you for harrassment. You think I am kidding you, hey you know how it is. Our children are our future, you can't spank em cos that's abuse, you can't shout at em, they have rights too. So what do they do, they run away with yer $500 to the arcade center. I kid you not, don't call the kid & harrass him. If he has spent your money, you get nada if parents don't accept responsibility & from the sounds of things the parents are probably too busy at work to notice what the kid is doing.
You remember the kid that bought millions of dollars worth of auction in eBay a year ago. All he got was a warning from the judge to bahave & mummy took his PC for 1 month. He could be back bidding in eBay right now.
posted on April 24, 2000 10:11:03 AM new
Ah yes, but he's also used his mother's name in the auction (providing this is a child playing games) which, according to people I've spoken to here in CT, makes her responsible. With her name on the money order, the responsibility lies on her.
Further, the kid you're speaking of BID upon auctions. He did not take someone's money. That can be thought of a larceny, and a child will be prosecuted for that.
I have only contacted the family once, and left it very cordial. I did not get ugly in any way, just called "in search of information."
I'll let the AGs nab him.
BSM
[ edited by apbabruce on Apr 24, 2000 01:55 PM ]
posted on April 24, 2000 05:41:11 PM new
Well, my friend the dishonest seller has once again emailed me with threats and accusations. The seller gets more and more whacked out with every email. I've asked the seller (very politely and repeatedly) to answer the following questions. Each time I ask these questions, they fall on deaf ears.
1. What service did you use to send the laptop to me?
2. What was the tracking number supplied by the service?
3. Why do you continue to brush off these honest questions? You know I'm going to ask them again and again until you answer.
4. Why did the original person who was the co-high bidder with me back out and cancel his bid?
5. Why is it that your profile states you are from NY, NY yet you had me send payment to Chicago?
6. Why is it that when I've emailed both the original co-high bidder (******) and the new high bidder (******), they do not respond.
7. Why is it each email from you is full of threats and accusations instead of information that will aid in the determination of the whereabouts of the laptop?
8. If you indeed sent my refund, what service did you use to obtain the money order and what was the number of that money order?
Gee, I wonder why these questions go unanswered...maybe because the seller cannot answer them without further burying themselves in a hole they're not going to get out of?
posted on April 25, 2000 06:50:25 PM new
Amazingly, the seller is still emailing me with nasty threats and accusations, claiming she will take court action if the laptop is not returned. I'd love to return it...if I had it.
Why would someone send a refund if she insisted she was right and said she was going to court? Weird.
posted on April 26, 2000 08:35:51 AM new
In conversation with USPS authorities today, I have discovered that my friend the seller who wants to sue me has not a leg to stand on. The seller has refused to produce proof of delivery (since according to USPS Postal Police it's on her head, not mine) and USPS authorities cannot find a package sent with a signature required for delivery from Chicago to my home in the past year.
Furthermore, the package would not have been left at someone else's home under their signature as the USPS does not allow that anymore. I would have received a yellow tag on my door, telling me to go to the post office to pick it up.
Predictably, the seller refuses to speak with the USPS Inspector who called, and is therefore hiding something. I'm not surprised.
posted on April 26, 2000 06:45:15 PM new
Amazingly, the laptop has been found. According to the seller, it was returned to her today "smashed to bits" and predictably she says I did it. Just how dumb can someone be?
This is so tiring. I'm really getting weary of the threats and accusations in my email. It's a damn shame she's had to be this way.
But as far as I'm concerned, the matter is closed. Her view of the issue will probably be different, but I'm not sure I care anymore.
posted on April 26, 2000 09:37:42 PM new
SORRY TO HEAR ABOUT YOUR EXPERIENCE - BUT it is not related to Yahoo - could easily have happened to you on eBay or any where else.
I WISH BUYERS WOULD STOP USING MONEY ORDERS - they aren't that safe, they cost extra, they are hard to trace, etc., and those SEKKERSM who demand Money Orders ONLY - I highly distrust.
I am a seller, and personally I wish to gosh everyone would use either a Personal Check or Credit Cards.....transactions made with credit cards are safe, and fast.
Well I am sorry you had this experience - but perhaps next time you'll think twice about using a Money Order.
