Dear Yahoo! Seller,
Thank you for usingYahoo! Shopping Used Goods (formerly known as Yahoo! Warehouse). We appreciate your business. We want to let you know about important changes to the Used Goods area in Yahoo! Shopping. From now on, Used Goods will consist of product listings exclusively from Yahoo! Shopping merchants. Although you will no longer be able to sell used goods using the current process, you can continue to sell your used goods through other Yahoo! services.
What happens to my current Used Goods listings?
• Buyers will be able to purchase your items until 12:01 a.m. on October 16, 2002.
• You will be able to confirm new purchases until two days after orders are placed.
• You will be able to access the "My Used Goods" page for the next few months to track your purchases and sales. Please note: Buyers may still contact you with fulfillment questions or problems over the next 60 days.
• You will be paid for all your sales according to the existing schedule.
How can I continue to sell stuff on Yahoo!?
There are three great ways to continue selling on Yahoo!.
• Yahoo! Store: build, manage, and promote your own e-commerce storefront and gain access to millions of customers on Yahoo! Shopping.
• Yahoo! Auctions: a great place to sell collectibles and let bidders drive up your prices.
• Yahoo! Classifieds: better and faster than your local newspaper, with access to a wide audience of local and national buyers.
Learn more about all the great ways to sell on Yahoo! by visiting sell.yahoo.com.
Please feel free to contact us with any questions at: [email protected].
posted on October 11, 2002 06:12:25 PM newI've got 18,000 items listed. That'd be around $1800 a month in Yahoo Store listing fees.
Sounds like Bidville would be your best option.
And I thought the auction fees were the stupidest mistake they could have made. I guess they managed to top it.
Best thing they ever did. This was an excellent idea as well. Yahoo shares surged 23 percent from going from free to fee based services. They need to focus on the auctions more.
posted on October 11, 2002 07:13:05 PM new
Blairwitch said "Sounds like Bidville would be your best option."
A) Bidville is an AUCTION site.
B) I want SELL items, deal with bidders.
C) Bidville is a sucky auction site anyway!
But seriously, comparing an auction site with a "selling" site just isn't the same thing. I use both Ebay & Yahoo auctions for "auction quality" merchandise - collectibles and other "rare-ish" items. For run of the mill videos, music and books, Yahoo "Used Goods", Half and Amazon are much better suited than auction sites.
As far as the auction fees, I meant the original 20 Cents/auction or whatever it was that nearly destroyed the site. I have little complain over the newer 5 cent auctions.
posted on October 11, 2002 07:58:01 PM new
Why does yahoo always do these things? gheesh not much notice either?Many are quitting Yahoo auctions too or only listing on FLD, now i cannot even get into paydirect & that means my winners can't either.
I just posted this at another board..could be an answer for some of you?
i found a place a great place,actually making sales,no listing fees,software to stop scammers,great support,no waiting all buy now or offers,you may link to websites as long as you link back,import feedback,want ads link to your listings is working cannot believe it is so fun like ebay was years ago! great people at chat too scoop shop...
check it out..a real surprise,steady sales
www.ioffer.com (used to be e-wanted,lots of traffic)
..good luck wherever you sell
posted on October 11, 2002 08:29:48 PM newA) Bidville is an AUCTION site. B) I want SELL items, deal with bidders. C) Bidville is a sucky auction site anyway!
You got a point there.....three that is!
As far as the auction fees, I meant the original 20 Cents/auction or whatever it was that nearly destroyed the site. I have little complain over the newer 5 cent auctions.
I agree yahoo wanted to rid the site of junk, but the nickel would have worked just as well. We all know where the junk went.
timetravelers warehouse sites dont generate much revenue. Yahoo is making more money on their fee services. The biggest advantage yahoo has is the many revenue portals ebay doesnt have. eBay must have auction fees to survive, but yahoo has other revenue. They need to 1. add real customer support reps, 2. fix and make paydirect free for auctions & cheaper than paypal for non auctions, 3. promote the auctions. Its not a matter of if they will, but when. The stock holders must be very happy with the 23% increase.
posted on October 11, 2002 09:32:59 PM new
replaymedia does make a good point about the items their own items, but is it profitable for Yahoo? I am guessing not. Since the majority are books and the like, Amazon tends to hold the market. Books are not my forte, but I would guess Half would be the next option for most of the book sellers. I am not sure of what other sites are out there for books, but I would bet that Yahoo ranks quite low in that catagory. With that said, on the surface it would appear the revenue generated doesn't cover the cost of running the site. They might have also decided that many of the items listed there would be better suited listed in auctions and are betting that those sellers will simply shift many of their items into the auction forum or open a Yahoo store.
I also agree with replay and blair that bidville as inviting as it may be is an warehouse site and not a selling site.
[ edited by stonecold613 on Oct 12, 2002 02:41 PM ]
posted on October 11, 2002 10:49:57 PM new
Hopefully Yahoo brass has been reading this board and my many pleas for them to get rid of the Used Goods unit. After that is completed that can lift the prohibitive nickle listing fees on Yahoo Used Goods caliber items and raise the FVF to a respectable 7% or 8%. To help rid the site of deadbeats ( I got a lot on the last FVF ) they can institute an ebay-like 'three NPB strikes and you're out' system. A $1 starting bid minimum would help keep the crud out of the auction.
Yahoo can even abandon the auction format alltogether since 98% of the items sold there go on the first bid.
posted on October 11, 2002 11:12:27 PM new
Tooltimes- Yes, but they could have done all that and still kept Used Goods as an additional revenue generator.
But back to auctions, here's my "Dream Yahoo"
A) Yahoo requires a Credit Card for validation. Therefore all bidders have one.
B) Yahoo Owns Paydirect, a payment service.
So why not simple automatically charge buyers for their Yahoo Auction purchases?
They charge buyers on Yahoo Used Goods for their purchases, so why not with auctions?
No more deadbeats!
No more end of auction e-mails!
No more no-contact buyers!
Easier Payments.
Quicker Transactions.
Yahoo wouldn't have to offer FVF credits, as every transaction would be completed.
posted on October 12, 2002 06:20:06 AM new
auction fever is fading fast,take a look at ebay,many items receive no bids.
set up a yahoo shop,it is worth the investment.
posted on October 12, 2002 07:47:09 AM new
Used Goods had to go. There may have been a very few sellers that had a measure of success but most sellers only had a tiny handful of sales. And the huge sellers like abesbooks had so many bad transcations by not having the books they listed that many buyers stayed away from Used Goods after getting burned. If, and it's a mighty big if, Yahoo reverts back to the no listing fee structure on the auction unit then they would be a LOT of double listed items as sellers would leave their Used Goods items in place in hopes of possible sales. Buyers, especially new buyers, could be confused by the very similar Yahoo units.
The only drawback to the dream Yahoo Auctions scenario is probably the same reason why ebay has stayed away from simply charging credit cards for auction goods ... there would almost certainly be a very high percentage of credit card chargebacks as well as possibly high bookkeeping costs. When a credit card is used and the buyer is not 100% satisfied the can usually call their credit card company and reverse the charges. That would allow a form of buyers remorse in the form of " Why did a buy that damn elephant's foot lamp anyway? " and allow finicky buyers to weasel out of accepting their purchases. When you go to a live auction there are numerous written and oral warnings that says 'it's yours when you leave here' but a credit card purchase is a different thing especially in cases of out-and-out fraud.
posted on October 12, 2002 09:40:50 AM new
askdaruma auction fever on ebay isnt fading, the site is simply saturated with too much merchandise there isnt a demand for. Sellers are to blame because they refuse to build up another venue. For example, lets say I have a "widget" that is currently "hip", and I place this item on ebay where there are 100 more just like it. The item either doesnt sell, or doesnt make a decent profit. On yahoo there are no others listed and for the same $.30 you could list the item for 60 days! My point is too much merchandise can be a bad thing......great for cheap buyers, but bad for sellers looking to make a profit.
Tooltimes I agree a credit card venue would not work. Paypal knew it all along. They must have the nickel listing fee or a mass of low-demand items would flood the site in a weeks time. One thing they could do would be charge the nickel, and if the item sells credit the sellers account the insertion fee. The main goal would be to keep the low-quality items at bidville.
posted on October 12, 2002 03:21:16 PM new
you are right,auction the same stuff over and over again ,why bid higher,more will come soon.
also do people really need all thse used one of a kind stuff??
get a shop on yahoo,thats the way to go
posted on October 12, 2002 06:44:35 PM new
replaymedia you could list some items on yahoo auctions, and then link to your site. Yahoo's link policy is much more liberal than ebays. It would be cheap advertising.
posted on October 12, 2002 08:17:36 PM new
Thanks replaymedia. That's way too much for a Yahoo Store. Yahoo should scrap those too. Perhaps Yahoo could make the auction into two seperate units, one unit for common items like those in the soon-to-be gone Used Goods unit and one unit for auction goods. The same setup for the auctions as now but the Used Goods unit would have no listing fees and a 7.5% FVF and allow only books, music CDs, and videos.
I think the buyers rarely found the Used Goods unit and many may have avoided the Used Goods unit because they wanted new goods only. ( Whoever renamed the Yahoo Warehouse to the Yahoo Used Goods should be shot! )
posted on October 12, 2002 09:43:23 PM new
Tooltimes sez - "Whoever renamed the Yahoo Warehouse to the Yahoo Used Goods should be shot!"
Man, you got that right! Stupid Stupid Stupid!
"Warehouse" wasn't great, but "Used Goods?" GAK!
Blairwitch sez- "list some items on yahoo auctions, and then link to your site."
I do that already (I do the maximum allowed, I don't want to get thrown off) But still, It's more "clicking" for the customer, which means I'd be less likely to get sales.
Amazon's been getting flaky the past few months as well.
I'd hate to think we may only have Half.com to rely on soon. (Shudder)
I did just finally re-open my eBay store. I had the same results as everyone else back when it was free, but I think it may time for another try...
posted on October 12, 2002 10:19:57 PM new
replaymedia,
Your own post explains be the main reason for the change.
So, as I mentioned above, I have 18,000 items. That translates to $1,849.95 each month, while Yahoo Used Goods cost NOTHING.
As a business person, if I give away all of my product, I won't stay in business very long. I personally didn't do the Used Goods thing, but can see why the need to close it came about. If they were to contact all of the people that listed there and tell them that they needed to add fees to survive, do you think any one would have stayed? My bet is very few. They did that once with auctions and almost shot themselves in the foot. They did survive that and did make the auctions site much better. Could they do it again with Used Goods. I doubt it and I am sure that is there thought process. Either start charging for services rendered or get rid of the dead skin. Neither choice I would consider to be good, but what they are doing is the lesser evil. On a personal note, as a Yahoo auctioneer, I welcome anyone that was visiting Used Goods to come on over Yahoo Auctions and take a look. But from what I have also been hearing, that won't be many.
posted on October 13, 2002 07:36:19 AM new
Used Goods charges 10%. The low profit auction charges 2.5% FVF on most items plus the nickel or more listing fee. Used Goods brought in very little money because almost no one used it. ( no pun intended )
The logical choice is to now close the auction since it brings in almost revenue as well. That may happen by the end of the year. Then Yahoo can concentrate on the remaining professional Yahoo Shopping units instead of the amateurish Used Goods and auctions.
Those are not my sentiments but apparently is the thinking of the Yahoo brass on the future of profitable online selling.
posted on October 13, 2002 09:33:23 AM new
Tooltimes bids,
What are you talking about? Closing auctions. Why would they close something that is clearly making them money. Since they lowered the listing fees allowing many quality items back onto their site, sale have never been better. And since the system isn't clogged up with crap (see Bidville for crap) their opperating expenses are much lower. With listing fees and FVF's coming in at rates well above any third tier site, it would be stupid to close auctions. Used Goods didn't have it, so it makes sense to close it. As I have stated many times in the past, I was one of the pissed off ones that left Yahoo when they started listing fees. I too left for Bidville. It was then that I realized what Yahoo meant by ridding itself of crap auctions. They all went to bidville and Yahoo prospered. They also knew that lowering listing fees was the right thing to do as they also knew that they are not ebay and shouldn't be charging ebay type fees. They are now reasonable and the sell through rate is quite good. When you can list a quality item 6 times for the same price as listing it only one time without a relist, at least in my experience, I end up with a sale just from exposure.
Close auctions? I think not.
posted on October 13, 2002 01:24:10 PM new
Add up all the nickels on Yahoo Auctions ( 10 to 14 days durations ) and you get almost zilch. Add up the tiny FVF on the few items that do sell on Yahoo Auctions and you get almost zilch. I bet the Yahoo Used Goods unit made more money for them then the dead auction. The Yahoo Auctions unit ( except for the profitable Yahoo-Japan unit ) will be closed very soon. Yahoo is busy reporting profits and there are very little from their Yahoo Auction unit so it will go. I'm glad they closed the Used Goods Unit first though.
This could send a serious ripple through the online auction world indicating that the online auction craze is all but dead except for ebay. Look for many other online auctions to close soon afterwards.
posted on October 13, 2002 02:55:08 PM new
To see if yahoo auctions make any money, we need to break down the numbers. Lets say they have 250,000 items that are listed every 10 days. With 365 days in the year, we will estimate the items listed 36 times since the numbers dont drop below 250,000. All estimates are for nickel listings.
250,000 x $.05 = $12,500
$12,500 x 36 = $450,000
With the listings fee, promotion fees, etc, We can say they are making around $500,000.00 or more yearly in insertion and promotion fees.
Now for the FVF. If yahoo has a 10% sell thru rate on each 250,000 items, and the items end on average at $6.50 with a FVF of 2% that would be:
25,000 x $6.50 = $162,500
$162,500 x 36 = $5,850,000
$5,850,000 x 2% average = $117,000
I think its safe to say yahoo is making at least $650,000 yearly on auctions, compared to the zero profit they were making when the auctions were free. They made staff cuts, and are making a nice profit. They wont get rid of the auction portal making this much profit.
posted on October 13, 2002 04:13:27 PM new
Blairwitch- I sure *HOPE* those numbers are wrong. But your number *DON'T* look wrong.
$650,000 wouldn't even pay a staff of 10 for a year. This explains why every e-mail response is an automatic canned response.
I'm sure Yahoo auctions has a biggers staff than that, but I don't see how.
Profit? I don't see any here. The maintenance on their hardware probably comes to more than this.
Yahoo is in far worse shape than I thought. Why would a company the size of Yahoo even wanbt to deal with a subdivision that can't even bring in a million a year?
Now you wanna talk about beating a dead horse? Haw about Amazon's auctions? They CAN'T be making any money there either. Marketplace, sure- but who uses their auctions profitably?
posted on October 13, 2002 06:00:26 PM new
I think BW's numbers are a bit rosy at that. Many sellers use the bulk loader and get 14 days for a nickel on sub $10 items. There are still a lot of $1 items listed on Yahoo and I think the $6.50 average is too high, maybe $5 is closer. The 10% sell through is too high and I think somewhere between 5% and 7% is more realistic.
The staff workers make at least $50K/year with benies and the big wheels make $200K
In the beginning there was hope for the future of the auctions but their trial run is almost over. They never produced and do not look promising at all.
posted on October 13, 2002 07:09:49 PM new$650,000 wouldn't even pay a staff of 10 for a year. This explains why every e-mail response is an automatic canned response.
I dont think they have 10 people working on the auctions. They got rid of most employees a while back.
I'm sure Yahoo auctions has a biggers staff than that, but I don't see how.
The employees that take care of auctions, also take care of the whole yahoo shopping portal. The auctions is a small piece of the pie.
Profit? I don't see any here. The maintenance on their hardware probably comes to more than this.
Maintenance is cheap, which is how sites like bidville survive.
Yahoo is in far worse shape than I thought. Why would a company the size of Yahoo even wanbt to deal with a subdivision that can't even bring in a million a year?
On average the auction site is bringing in a million dollars yearly. My fee estimates were conservative, and its hard to tell how much they make from advertisers on the auction home page.
--------------------------------------------
I think BW's numbers are a bit rosy at that. Many sellers use the bulk loader and get 14 days for a nickel on sub $10 items. There are still a lot of $1 items listed on Yahoo and I think the $6.50 average is too high, maybe $5 is closer. The 10% sell through is too high and I think somewhere between 5% and 7% is more realistic.
Tooltimes some sellers do use the the 14 day option, but my estimate was based on nickel listings, no counting the higher listing fees, so it should average out. Same goes for the FVF. Some are low, and others high. From my research yahoo has a 10-12% sale rate across the board.
The staff workers make at least $50K/year with benies and the big wheels make $200K
Correct, but we must remember yahoo in the past gave their service for free, and had many reps on hand while making zero profit. If they did not eliminate the auctions then, they wont now.
In the beginning there was hope for the future of the auctions but their trial run is almost over. They never produced and do not look promising at all.
They never produced when they were free either, so its not their fault. Sellers had the choice of paying ebay ever-rising fees, or selling for free on yahoo. When they started fees the successful sellers stayed, while the bulk of the junk went to bidville. 85-90% of yahoos free auctions were advertising, recipies, nickel cards, and high priced books.
And now ebay sellers are stewing in their own juice by not building up another site. ebay is flooded with merchandise so bad its almost impossible to make a good profit. Its a buyers market only now.
posted on October 13, 2002 07:21:50 PM new
BW Said "Its a buyers market only now. "
Well, this week I tried a little experiment with eBay & Yahoo.
I listed 22 items that I have multiples of on BOTH sites, at the exact same starting bid and BIN prices. These are NEW items, that anyone bidding on them knows exactly what they are getting- quality isn't an issue. And I have excellent feedback on both sites.
Result:
1 sale on Yahoo at starting bid amount
16 sales on eBay, 6 with multiple bids
At the very least, those 6 auctions with multiple bids could have gotten their item for LESS at Yahoo. But they didn't look there.
posted on October 13, 2002 10:04:05 PM new
Yahoo Auctions at best is breaking even in my opinion. It is only a very tiny auction when compared to the mighty ebay. Yahoo may be getting tired of hearing how unsuccessful their auctions are when compared to ebay.
I truly wish that Yahoo will give the free auction listings with a 7% FVF and an ebay 3 final NPBs and you're gone setup a try before pulling the plug on their auction. Even if they only sell a few thousand items a day they will at least get 7% FVFs. The old free auction setup let the common items sit till they found a buyer like the Used Goods & Half venues do. Make a starting bid of at least $1 so Yahoo gets a minimum of 7 cents on every transaction. There will be millions of items soon and those 7% FVFs add up quick. Auction sellers will then have a choice of no listing fee and a 75 cent minimum start bid with a 15% FVF at Half or a no listing fee with a $1 minimum start bid and a 7% FVF at Yahoo. I'm betting the sellers will easily pick Yahoo over Half.
